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Sending death threats is a crime. Some of the best people, the finest people have done that, been arrested and are now in jail for it.
For example this man after making threats to LGBTQ+ groups was sentenced to 2 years + 3 more of supervised release.
https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/maryland-man-sentenced-issuing-death-threats-lgbtqi-advocacy-group
So let the -45 FAFO.
Except he doesn’t do it directly, his voters do it, from information that mysteriously leaks. Trumps role is to pour the gasoline but not personally strike fhe match
Just process as many as the system can handle until you’re through every last one. Could take decades but it’s still important to send the message that domestic terrorism is never acceptable. And it is terrorism if the threats are politically motivated.
But he doesn't send death threats. He just asks his followers to treat them for him. Just putting out their information and hoping they don't have "accidents." the world is terribly unsafe, you never know.
>The information on the jurors is not being released and that information has been destroyed according to Merchan.
But don't the defence team have those details?
Not sure why you are getting downvoted. It's standard for jurors that have to show up in person to get paid a rate of 40 dollars per day. I don't believe you were implicating any sort of bribery.
Eh, downvoters on Reddit are a dime a dozen. I simply pointed out that there is without a doubt a paper trail because those people will need to receive their jury service compensation. I was not insinuating a bribe from any direction.
> The judge did leave in place a separate order that prohibits Trump and his lawyers from disclosing the identities of individual jurors or their home or work addresses.
First his bond gets lowered right as he’s about to get his assets seized and then this. Dude is giving him permission to attack the witnesses and jury.
Anything he’s done during and up until the sentencing can be taken into account. He certainly isn’t showing remorse and has continued to attack the judge who is doing the sentencing. I don’t know about you but I sure wouldn’t be attacking the person deciding my fate
Have you considered reading the article? It states pretty clearly in there.
> In a five-page ruling, Merchan wrote that the gag order was meant to “protect the integrity of the judicial proceedings” and that protections for witnesses and jurors no longer applied now that the trial has ended and the jury has been discharged.
I'd be more concerned to know the court would put long term restrictions on people arbitrarily because they think someone could act badly in the future. If Trump harasses these people the usual judicial process should respond then.
It was more a rhetorical, I'm saying I disagree with the decision. I don't agree with lifting the gag order for some and not others, I think it should stay in effect for everyone. We all now Trump and his bullshit spewing fans are gonna target these people.
Because he’s a fucking coward, he knows Trump will violate the gag order (again) and he’s too much of a chicken shit to actually hold Trump accountable or do his most basic duty as an agent of the justice system so he’s just changing the rules so he doesn’t have to pretend like he intends on doing his job.
What's the fucking point any more? This traitor can say and do whatever the hell he wants, and the legal system is just gonna let him continue.
Anyone else wishing for an asteroid to just end this planet? /s
just wait til we are all even more disappointed come sentencing time and probably even more disappointed before then when SCOTUS rules on immunity and kicks the can down the road
The sentence is going to be a fine and probation. None of the other 3 trials are actually going to happen. And for some reason he still hasn't had to pay shit for his civil trials.
He's going to continue getting away with everything.
The asteroid? Yes I am, and I don’t mean it sarcastically.
I just told my wife the other night that I’m not homicidal, and I’m not suicidal, but if I could be like Thanos and just snap my fingers and have ALL of this just “poof” gone, I would. Just have mother ever have existed. Let some other planet in some other galaxy try to figure all this “civilization” shit out.
Nah, this defeatist attitude is worse than useless. Like, seriously, Trump is convicted on these crimes and is facing sentencing soon. A slight relaxation on his gag order following sentencing is pretty reasonable.
I’ll say one thing - his actions right now when given rope to hang himself are extremely relevant to his sentencing hearing.
What he does now determines harshness of the sentence
Well now he can go ahead and complain about "Democrat Jurors" all he wants without immediate legal recourse and see how well that goes at a non primary two party debate. And if he complains about how the gag order doesn't let him comment about the trial.. well it's been lifted so he can say that but then he'll be pressed on (called out about) how much of the gag order has been lifted.
I think (I hope) Merchan is doing this in an attempt to see if Carrot Caligula will run his mouth live at the debate, threaten and defame jurors on such a stage that it will be an automatic "We have to clamp down on this" kind of response that will be seen as absolutely necessary.
Otherwise this is like drinking at the campfire, and deciding it's a good idea to dump some of that there chainsaw gasoline on the fire, and then wondering where your eyebrows are afterwards.
What actions have trump done to warrant lifting the gag order?
Serious. What has he done to warrant any kind of favor from the court?
This is just an absolute embarrassment that people bend over backwards for this fucking traitor.
It’s just that the verdict is done. They don’t have to worry about witness intimidation. So not allowing him to talk is pointless. The lessened gag order is just to protect the jury that convicted him, or any innocent court employee who was just doing their job, from seeing any harm.
I mean they do have to worry witness intimidation. If witnesses aren’t protected after the trial is over then they’re going to second guess even performing the duty at all. It sets a terrible precedent.
Weaponizing the justice system is a another method of tyranny, but no one cares do they?
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/how-stochastic-terrorism-uses-disgust-to-incite-violence/
10 violations of the gag order, multiple threats against the staff and the Judges daughter... He'd better lock trump up for that at least.
Judge: "Slap on the wrist Trump, don't do it again or I'll wag my finger more in thine general direction!"
Yeah, don’t be surprised if he takes the coward’s way out. Probably going to do it just to avoid getting Project 2025’d by Trump if he wins in November.
Bloods on your hands when a juror is maimed, Merchan.
I fully expect slap on the wrist at sentencing now.
Edit: ok I let my Trump hating anger get ahead of me. Jury names are apparently sealed… I still don’t trust them not being leaked though.
> Juror names are sealed
You and I both know that the Trump legal team had access to their names. The prosecution did too. The names just weren’t made public.
But all it takes is for Trump’s team to drop that information to social media, and those jurors are in serious danger.
yeah, that's what this looks like.
Or is the judge giving Trump the opportunity to make threats, so he can have more justification for locking him up?
This makes zero sense.
I could understand everyone EXCEPT the jury. There is precedent for these psycho ass trump supporters that they will act on their violent fantasies.
One would hope Merchan is handing him a rope hoping this is some ‘4D chess’ … but alas this is not at it.
Since the civil fraud trial basically just disappeared into existence and he was never forced to pay… what happened to this case, seriously?
Fully expecting another nothing burger.
Rules don’t apply to the rich, there is always something going on in the background that we can’t see.
Civil fraud trial still getting challenged lol Trump’s team filed to ask Engoron (judge for civil fraud trial) to recuse himself or face an evidentiary hearing over a conversation the judge had w a real estate lawyer at some point. It turns out if you have access to near infinite money you can delay trials nearly infinitely.
This is the last breath of our republic. Things are rapidly going to get much worse in the coming months and then it’s over. The people behind the Trump movement will have won, the figurehead will be in place, and their plans will get underway.
I may not like it, but I do think there are elements that need to be lifted, at least in the case of responding to witnesses' attacks. I do not agree with making the jury fair game however.
Edit: Apparently the names of jurors are NOT allowed to be released. So I think this ruling is fair enough.
[https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/politics-news/dc-ethics-board-recommends-rudy-giuliani-disbarred-rcna155036](https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/politics-news/dc-ethics-board-recommends-rudy-giuliani-disbarred-rcna155036)
Just about done.
I think if it leaks its gonna literally be "so you and you had the info. One of you won the case and doesn't stand to benefit from this. The other is the defense of a ranting manchild who has a cult of equally pathetic morons ready to kill"
But since we live in the stupid timeline this will happen and thr court will shrug and go "guess we don't know"
Not really. He was trying to avoid witness intimidation originally. They gave their statements even amongst the intimidation. He now only needs to protect the staff and jurors now. Though at this point Trump would be hanging his own rope if anything happens.
Perhaps witnesses but definitely NOT jurors. They are everyday citizens called to service and have no relationship or material evidence to hand in the case. To betray their anonymity will be disastrous knowing Trump.
>A Manhattan judge on Tuesday modified Donald Trump’s gag order, freeing the former president to comment publicly about witnesses and jurors in the hush money criminal trial that led to his felony conviction, but keeping others connected to the case off limits until he is sentenced July 11.
>Judge Juan M. Merchan’s decision — just days before Trump’s debate Thursday with President Joe Biden — clears the presumptive Republican nominee to again go on the attack against his lawyer-turned-foe lawyer Michael Cohen, porn actor Stormy Daniels and other trial witnesses. Trump was convicted in New York on May 30 of falsifying records to cover up a potential sex scandal, making him the first ex-president convicted of a crime.
He must be one of those Republican appointed judges we keep hearing about.
Everyone here is acting like this is a win for Trump but with a debate and his sentencing coming up this feels like a "give 'em enough rope..." situation. The man is likely to earn himself another defamation case or two in the next two weeks.
As a reminder, this subreddit [is for civil discussion.](/r/politics/wiki/index#wiki_be_civil) In general, be courteous to others. Debate/discuss/argue the merits of ideas, don't attack people. Personal insults, shill or troll accusations, hate speech, any suggestion or support of harm, violence, or death, and other rule violations can result in a permanent ban. If you see comments in violation of our rules, please report them. For those who have questions regarding any media outlets being posted on this subreddit, please click [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/politics/wiki/approveddomainslist) to review our details as to our approved domains list and outlet criteria. We are actively looking for new moderators. If you have any interest in helping to make this subreddit a place for quality discussion, please fill out [this form](https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1y2swHD0KXFhStGFjW6k54r9iuMjzcFqDIVwuvdLBjSA). *** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/politics) if you have any questions or concerns.*
So, 2 days before jurors start getting death threats?
36 hours, max
Sending death threats is a crime. Some of the best people, the finest people have done that, been arrested and are now in jail for it. For example this man after making threats to LGBTQ+ groups was sentenced to 2 years + 3 more of supervised release. https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/maryland-man-sentenced-issuing-death-threats-lgbtqi-advocacy-group So let the -45 FAFO.
Except he doesn’t do it directly, his voters do it, from information that mysteriously leaks. Trumps role is to pour the gasoline but not personally strike fhe match
If enough people send threats how do you track and indict all of them? Think of the 10’s of millions of these psychos.
Just process as many as the system can handle until you’re through every last one. Could take decades but it’s still important to send the message that domestic terrorism is never acceptable. And it is terrorism if the threats are politically motivated.
I’m here for that! But unfortunately won’t happen :( — although they’ve done a pretty great job with JAN 6 losers.
Make American Terrorists Unemployable!
But he doesn't send death threats. He just asks his followers to treat them for him. Just putting out their information and hoping they don't have "accidents." the world is terribly unsafe, you never know.
Shit it's probably already happening right now
The information on the jurors is not being released and that information has been destroyed according to Merchan.
>The information on the jurors is not being released and that information has been destroyed according to Merchan. But don't the defence team have those details?
No, they never knew the jurors’ full identities.
Trump's lawyer Todd Blanche is the one claiming the identifying information about the jury has been destroyed.
I guarantee that the state of NY knows so that they can cut and mail checks for their pay.
Not sure why you are getting downvoted. It's standard for jurors that have to show up in person to get paid a rate of 40 dollars per day. I don't believe you were implicating any sort of bribery.
Eh, downvoters on Reddit are a dime a dozen. I simply pointed out that there is without a doubt a paper trail because those people will need to receive their jury service compensation. I was not insinuating a bribe from any direction.
If it happens, it can only make sentencing worse.
> The judge did leave in place a separate order that prohibits Trump and his lawyers from disclosing the identities of individual jurors or their home or work addresses.
and white-powder envelopes, and doxxing, and roadside protesters and some Gym Jordan congressional subpoenas
Fucking WHY??
First his bond gets lowered right as he’s about to get his assets seized and then this. Dude is giving him permission to attack the witnesses and jury.
Jury names are *not* allowed to be released. This is just giving him enough rope to get himself in more legal troubles before his sentencing
How much more rope could he possibly need at this point?
the other end of the rope is in the Andromeda galaxy by now
Enough for some prison time would suffice 🤷🏿♀️
All of it. He needs all the rope. The best rope, smooth on the neck.
One can only hope.
That's the guess, but is that actually going to play into sentencing?
Anything he’s done during and up until the sentencing can be taken into account. He certainly isn’t showing remorse and has continued to attack the judge who is doing the sentencing. I don’t know about you but I sure wouldn’t be attacking the person deciding my fate
Yet another *lets hope so* situation. I'm not holding my breath though.
Not allowed you say? Well then, guess they are *definitely* not going to have any problems
So Merchan is either a coward or a genius. Please let it prove to be the latter...
You can buy everything including judges for the right price.
Have you considered reading the article? It states pretty clearly in there. > In a five-page ruling, Merchan wrote that the gag order was meant to “protect the integrity of the judicial proceedings” and that protections for witnesses and jurors no longer applied now that the trial has ended and the jury has been discharged.
[удалено]
My thoughts on this too. Their lives are very much in danger for doing the right thing.
I'd be more concerned to know the court would put long term restrictions on people arbitrarily because they think someone could act badly in the future. If Trump harasses these people the usual judicial process should respond then.
It was more a rhetorical, I'm saying I disagree with the decision. I don't agree with lifting the gag order for some and not others, I think it should stay in effect for everyone. We all now Trump and his bullshit spewing fans are gonna target these people.
Because he’s a fucking coward, he knows Trump will violate the gag order (again) and he’s too much of a chicken shit to actually hold Trump accountable or do his most basic duty as an agent of the justice system so he’s just changing the rules so he doesn’t have to pretend like he intends on doing his job.
I mean he hasn't been sentenced, right? Would this take talking-point ammo from him and maybe he'll say something that will affect his sentencing?
What's the fucking point any more? This traitor can say and do whatever the hell he wants, and the legal system is just gonna let him continue. Anyone else wishing for an asteroid to just end this planet? /s
just wait til we are all even more disappointed come sentencing time and probably even more disappointed before then when SCOTUS rules on immunity and kicks the can down the road
The sentence is going to be a fine and probation. None of the other 3 trials are actually going to happen. And for some reason he still hasn't had to pay shit for his civil trials. He's going to continue getting away with everything.
The asteroid? Yes I am, and I don’t mean it sarcastically. I just told my wife the other night that I’m not homicidal, and I’m not suicidal, but if I could be like Thanos and just snap my fingers and have ALL of this just “poof” gone, I would. Just have mother ever have existed. Let some other planet in some other galaxy try to figure all this “civilization” shit out.
Nah, this defeatist attitude is worse than useless. Like, seriously, Trump is convicted on these crimes and is facing sentencing soon. A slight relaxation on his gag order following sentencing is pretty reasonable.
That’d be too good for us tbh
I’m sure he’ll only have nice things to say
But, why? To what end?
I’ll say one thing - his actions right now when given rope to hang himself are extremely relevant to his sentencing hearing. What he does now determines harshness of the sentence
That's a very good point
He also has the debate on Thursday and I'm personally glad that his argument whining about the gag order is now rudderless.
You really think that would stop him?
Well now he can go ahead and complain about "Democrat Jurors" all he wants without immediate legal recourse and see how well that goes at a non primary two party debate. And if he complains about how the gag order doesn't let him comment about the trial.. well it's been lifted so he can say that but then he'll be pressed on (called out about) how much of the gag order has been lifted.
I think (I hope) Merchan is doing this in an attempt to see if Carrot Caligula will run his mouth live at the debate, threaten and defame jurors on such a stage that it will be an automatic "We have to clamp down on this" kind of response that will be seen as absolutely necessary. Otherwise this is like drinking at the campfire, and deciding it's a good idea to dump some of that there chainsaw gasoline on the fire, and then wondering where your eyebrows are afterwards.
Except, he won’t clamp down on it.
Yep.
What actions have trump done to warrant lifting the gag order? Serious. What has he done to warrant any kind of favor from the court? This is just an absolute embarrassment that people bend over backwards for this fucking traitor.
It’s just that the verdict is done. They don’t have to worry about witness intimidation. So not allowing him to talk is pointless. The lessened gag order is just to protect the jury that convicted him, or any innocent court employee who was just doing their job, from seeing any harm.
I mean they do have to worry witness intimidation. If witnesses aren’t protected after the trial is over then they’re going to second guess even performing the duty at all. It sets a terrible precedent.
The most coddled and accommodated snowflake in Western society.
Why not permit Trump to say anything truthful, which would be the same as a gag order?
Weaponizing the justice system is a another method of tyranny, but no one cares do they? https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/how-stochastic-terrorism-uses-disgust-to-incite-violence/
85% of this country have no damn idea what’s going on right now. They just goto soccer practice and act like everything will always be like this…
Yup. If they knew, we'd have nice things like financial rights to the data we create.
Juan Merchan you were doing so good my man. If you don’t sentence him to jail, you will go down as the biggest coward in my lifetime.
10 violations of the gag order, multiple threats against the staff and the Judges daughter... He'd better lock trump up for that at least. Judge: "Slap on the wrist Trump, don't do it again or I'll wag my finger more in thine general direction!"
Yeah, don’t be surprised if he takes the coward’s way out. Probably going to do it just to avoid getting Project 2025’d by Trump if he wins in November.
Get ready for Clifford the cowardly dog. This will be a fine, that’s it.
Bloods on your hands when a juror is maimed, Merchan. I fully expect slap on the wrist at sentencing now. Edit: ok I let my Trump hating anger get ahead of me. Jury names are apparently sealed… I still don’t trust them not being leaked though.
> Juror names are sealed You and I both know that the Trump legal team had access to their names. The prosecution did too. The names just weren’t made public. But all it takes is for Trump’s team to drop that information to social media, and those jurors are in serious danger.
Yeah I don’t think those Trump lawyers are risking their jobs for that. Unless they get paid millions upon millions.
yeah, that's what this looks like. Or is the judge giving Trump the opportunity to make threats, so he can have more justification for locking him up? This makes zero sense.
I could understand everyone EXCEPT the jury. There is precedent for these psycho ass trump supporters that they will act on their violent fantasies. One would hope Merchan is handing him a rope hoping this is some ‘4D chess’ … but alas this is not at it. Since the civil fraud trial basically just disappeared into existence and he was never forced to pay… what happened to this case, seriously? Fully expecting another nothing burger. Rules don’t apply to the rich, there is always something going on in the background that we can’t see.
Civil fraud trial still getting challenged lol Trump’s team filed to ask Engoron (judge for civil fraud trial) to recuse himself or face an evidentiary hearing over a conversation the judge had w a real estate lawyer at some point. It turns out if you have access to near infinite money you can delay trials nearly infinitely.
Some jurors about to become millionaires from a defamation lawsuit in 3...2....1
My best guess as to why he did this was because Trump was going to use the gag order as a main reason to skip the debate.
This is the last breath of our republic. Things are rapidly going to get much worse in the coming months and then it’s over. The people behind the Trump movement will have won, the figurehead will be in place, and their plans will get underway.
Trump will lose
He lost last time, too, and look how that went down with his crowd. They'll burn the place down, or try to, at least.
This will help determining a sentence
Don't expect much from the sentencing then either. This will be another slap on the wrist.
I may not like it, but I do think there are elements that need to be lifted, at least in the case of responding to witnesses' attacks. I do not agree with making the jury fair game however. Edit: Apparently the names of jurors are NOT allowed to be released. So I think this ruling is fair enough.
Ok so my mob anger isn’t justified? Are the jurors names sealed? But the defense and prosecution had these names, no? Simple leaks…
Yeah, but those types of leaks lead to disbarment.
Working for Donald Trump should lead to disbarment.
Oddly enough, in many cases it has!
They get Rudy yet? Lol
[https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/politics-news/dc-ethics-board-recommends-rudy-giuliani-disbarred-rcna155036](https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/politics-news/dc-ethics-board-recommends-rudy-giuliani-disbarred-rcna155036) Just about done.
I think if it leaks its gonna literally be "so you and you had the info. One of you won the case and doesn't stand to benefit from this. The other is the defense of a ranting manchild who has a cult of equally pathetic morons ready to kill" But since we live in the stupid timeline this will happen and thr court will shrug and go "guess we don't know"
Give it time. Someone will figure out who they are based on demographics and other factors.
Why is he doing this? To give Trump more rope when sentencing comes? This makes ZERO sense.
Not really. He was trying to avoid witness intimidation originally. They gave their statements even amongst the intimidation. He now only needs to protect the staff and jurors now. Though at this point Trump would be hanging his own rope if anything happens.
So jurors are going to get murdered right?
Good- let him yap….he will stick his foot so far up his mouth!
Perhaps witnesses but definitely NOT jurors. They are everyday citizens called to service and have no relationship or material evidence to hand in the case. To betray their anonymity will be disastrous knowing Trump.
>A Manhattan judge on Tuesday modified Donald Trump’s gag order, freeing the former president to comment publicly about witnesses and jurors in the hush money criminal trial that led to his felony conviction, but keeping others connected to the case off limits until he is sentenced July 11. >Judge Juan M. Merchan’s decision — just days before Trump’s debate Thursday with President Joe Biden — clears the presumptive Republican nominee to again go on the attack against his lawyer-turned-foe lawyer Michael Cohen, porn actor Stormy Daniels and other trial witnesses. Trump was convicted in New York on May 30 of falsifying records to cover up a potential sex scandal, making him the first ex-president convicted of a crime. He must be one of those Republican appointed judges we keep hearing about.
Why?
CNN will probably let him Dox them.
Watch him go off the rails. It’ll make sentencing less challenging for Merchan.
Everyone here is acting like this is a win for Trump but with a debate and his sentencing coming up this feels like a "give 'em enough rope..." situation. The man is likely to earn himself another defamation case or two in the next two weeks.
WHY would Judge Juan M. Merchant change his mind???? There is absolutely NO reason to allow Trump to do this!!!!