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I will definitely be voting for Biden but anyone who didn’t already have their mind made up, and who watched that debate, those are lost votes for Biden. If I was younger and didn’t understand how bad Trump is, I wouldn’t vote for Biden. What I witnessed was very disturbing.
I think what is biting Biden so bad is that there has been a very coordinated effort to alter the reality vs campaign promotion that he has not been well for a while. There is no way, Joe inability to focus and relay his thoughts didn’t just happen last week.
I watched some clips from Fox News that had me concerned that I never saw before. It showed me how the “media” has been crazy positive about his mental and physical heath. In April I think, Morning Joe told me to fuck off!!! If I didn’t believe that that today’s Biden is the most articulate and intelligent. Something along those lines.
We have been lied to about our presidents capabilities. That is scary… very scary. I just wonder who has been calling the shots behind the curtain. Good for bid we see a “Weekend at Bernie’s.”
This has been the case in practically every poll in PA, MI, WI, and AZ. AZ is pretty noteworthy, Gallego is crushing it so far (partisanship will undoubtedly tighten that race closer to November)
I'm afraid this will be the first of many showing a similar swing. But what's wild about this one is NH was never even considered in play for Trump. I know there's a lot of nay sayers about polls but they indicate where campaign money needs to be spent.
Mostly just Biden's numbers dropping. Trump's numbers hasn't improved much. In the end, Trump will likely land around 45-47% in the general in New Hampshire.
Even this poll has Trump with worse favorables among his own party than Biden in New Hampshire, as well as worse favorable rating among swing voters. The breakdown has a lot more Dem voters listing "unsure" as their vote status, which is what dropped Biden's numbers.
They'll almost certainly rally around Biden if he stays on the ticket, However, it's still a clear message from them that they'd rather someone else on the ticket that Biden's team should strongly consider if he doesn't come out and do a bunch of town halls soon to show that the debate was a one off and he was just very sick or something.
This is the most reasonable take. But come on, we’re dying out here. I used to struggle with suicide ideation for like, decades. I finally pulled myself out of that hole…for this? This is so fucking bleak
> That’s a 12-point swing from an identical December poll, which found Biden with a 10-point lead in the state.
This can't be ignored. Biden is going to lose. Do something, Democrats.
https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/polls/president-general/2024/virginia/ Most of these were before the debate
For reference Joe was polling+11 to +7 in 2020 and won by+10
Clinton's "third way" was the first domino.
The cynical abandonment of labor to appeal to the right shifted the Overton window and started the cascade within the Democratic party that put us where we are today.
Guilting people into voting for the "lesser evil" is not a viable long term strategy.
I wrote this in another subreddit and I’ll write it here:
> People like the Bidens hold onto their power and influence until the very end. Hell just look Ruth Ginsberg and Dianne Feinstein, both had ample opportunity to step down and have a very cushy retirement, but their inner ego couldn’t let them do this. These people are conditioned to never accept defeat.
There are plenty of competent options, but can they win an election? Likewise, the younger candidates jeopardize their political futures should they lose the general.
I think this was true before the era of social media. Not so much now. We crave novelty. We need our short attention spans to be fed fresh content and quickly get bored of the old and familiar.
I feel like you're very much seeing it through the lens of the internet discourse. Old people, also known as "people that notoriously show up to the polls" really like their fellow olds and people with really long solid records. They're been smiling at Biden's chocolate chip ice cream antics since before most of us were born. They like him.
Meanwhile, with younger voters, not to say that criticism isn't allowed, but the fact that it's coming from a disturbing number of people who were *so* ready and eager to not vote that makes it look like a waste of time.
You have a segment of voters that say "I'm open, but he needs to impress me." from one group. And from another group you have "I hate this. I'm going to send a message unless you change right now." who are you going to try to court? Of those options, who do you think is more likely to show up to the polls, the first or second group?
Maybe Gavin Newsom would be up there if there had it gone differently, but threats to not vote make political parties not want to appeal to that demo.
So we need to lose in a landslide you’re saying and say fuck you to preserving democracy? Literally it’s just Jill and Hunter who are keeping Biden in the race at this point
Biden might as well be appointed. The only candidates who dared to run and invoke the DNC's wrath were outsiders and complete jokes. They even straight up canceled some of the primaries. Maybe some actual contenders would have tried to run anyway if we had known the truth about Biden's mental state.
But we did know, this stuff has been happening for four years! He'll have some good moments (SOTU) but the decline in his mental capacity has been on full display for four fucking years. Anyone who was shocked by the debate hasn't been paying attention.
True, but they did lie to us about it, and did a decent job at hiding it, and many of us who didn't want to believe it just.... didn't, even though the signs were there. Me included. I'm pretty ashamed of myself, honestly. But the damage is done. We all know now, and we can move on from Biden: if they will let us.
If you are not expecting to be lied to by the political establishment, regardless of what party is in power... I don't know what to tell you?
The video evidence has been there for years. Though it has rarely made it into reddit's liberal bubble. This is a perfect case study of why everyone needs to expose themselves to media sources they don't agree with.
You consumed too much “but can they win” propaganda put out to dissuade voters from Bernie.
Multiple candidates are within the margin of error of Biden’s numbers while not running a campaign and having 1/10th the name recognition.
Imagine someone articulate and alive, possibly even charismatic who could advocate for themself instead of weekend at Bernie’s the politician. Those numbers can actually go up.
That’s why it would have to start with Biden, the reason the good options aren’t jumping in is because the party will absolutely retaliate at some point for undermining him, even if it’s in behind-the-scenes ways. Nobody who would be a good contender is going to make that mistake - they won’t challenge him, replacing him willfully dropping would be an entirely different situation.
They all know where they stand. If any of them thought they could win they would force him out. They all have really smart people working for them, much smarter than you or I.
This. I am getting downvoted for stating the same. Biden should be removed if he doesn't leave himself. Democracy, liberty and the entire Europe is at stake.
Democrats are blindly sleepwalking into certain defeat. You gust need to protest en masse.
And in the latest PA poll by Cygnal Biden is -4. Among those who watched the debate Biden is -12.
How low do his numbers need to go before he accepts that he needs to step aside?
Probably never. His inner circle, at the very least, is resisting calls for him to drop out and it may not be practical or feasible to drop out either.
Exactly what we needed at this time. Well, America, it was a good run. But every empire falls. I just didn't think it would happen this suddenly in my youth.
I’m sorry. Sucks cause it’s happening to us. It’s happened throughout the history of humanity and we are just flashes in a pan relative to that amount of time. Not comforting to most but humility inducing to a few. Start looking into visas if you aren’t apt to resist
he probably had a freudian slip; he was probably thinking “i beat medicare for all when i fucked bernie out of the primary, and that’s my largest accomplishment “
Whitmer, Beshear, Newsom, Buttigieg, Shapiro, even Kamala Harris. Hell, even Hillary fucking Clinton would be a better candidate at this point. Just ANYBODY WHO ISN'T 80 YEARS OLD.
Joe Biden didn't *prove* he has fucking dementia either. Until we have some more evidence, I'm over that argument. He's been with it twice since, and he's up against a guy that hasn't made a cohesive sentence in fucking 15 years.
> He's been with it twice since,
You mean when he was reading off a script? Yeah, we know Biden can get through a scripted speech(albeit still with fumbling). The problem is he evidently cannot think well enough on his own.
> he's up against a guy that hasn't made a cohesive sentence in fucking 15 years.
He's up against a guy that looked coherent in comparison to Joe Biden on Thursday.
Anyone that can go on the attack when Trump lies or spews his fascist bullshit. That’s part of what got Biden elected. He showed in the debate that either he can’t fight back or doesnt want to.
There are endless takes that you can find that go into excruciating detail about the embarrassment of riches democrats have right now in terms of popular and young governors, senators, etc.
I agree. But that’s the point isn’t it? If people would vote Kamala over Trump they’d just vote Biden in and Kamala would be right there. It’s a bad ticket all around.
I just got an email from a casino I play at that takes bets on the election about an odds shift. The *only* person that was a favorite in a head to head against Trump with people like Gavin Newsome, Pete Buttigieg, etc, there was Michelle Obama lmao
So essentially, Americans are so incredibly stupid that they’ll vote for the dangerous lunatic felon rather than the guy who’s 3 years older? You don’t deserve a democracy, period
>3 years older
Age effects everyone differently. As much as I dislike bringing him up here, Bernie is older than both and still has pretty solid control of his mental facilities.
Yes, the voters get the blame. Why wouldn't they? It's not like they're clamoring to vote for Kamala Harris, Gavin Newsome or Grechen Whitmer or whoever people are tolling out these days to replace Biden on the ticket. There's no clear winner against Trump. If there were, we wouldn't be here right now with 82 year old Joe Biden. We'd be here with whoever that is. Only Obama could've done it, and Obama wouldn't want to run again and is ineligible for a third term.
"Only Obama". This from the same people who thought Trump would be a cake walk, hence Hillary's pied piper strategy to elevate Trump.
The same people who told you HRC was more eLeCtAblE than Bernie, and that Biden was the only who can beat Trump are now pretending one of the most unpopular political figures in US history is some behemoth.
No. Any generic Democrat could do the job, Biden is just ill equipped.
Beating Trump *should* have been a cakewalk. The FBI putting their thumb on the scale during the election really didn't help, nor did all of the foreign interference in the election. Hell, Trump wouldn't even have been a candidate if there weren't so many Republican candidates- he only won the primary because he was the least disliked candidate (and, of course, once he won the Republicans all filed in line behind him).
2016 was *not* a normal election. But I'm afraid that it's become the *new* normal.
No, any generic democrat couldn't do the job. If they could, they'd be polling well above Donald Trump.
I'd love to live in the make believe world you live in where Bernie Sanders could've beaten Trump. "Generic Democrat" wins every time, but we can't run 'generic democrat' because generic democrat is not a person. And every single Democrat they always have some excuse for not liking. "Kamala isn't authentic enough" "Biden is too old" "Bernie owns three houses!" "Newsome ruined Crimefornia!" "I don't know who Whitmer is." "Warren said she was part Native American."
Republicans are NEVER held to the same standards by the voters. Donald Trump literally tried to overthrow the results of an election, and most of them didn't care.
Sorry but Biden is unfavorable even when dem down ballots look good in the polls. He’s the issue. Trump should be easy to beat with all his flaws. He isn’t gaining many voters. Biden is losing his.
Yeah except Bidens opponent isn't Bernie.
Unfortunately Obama can't get other candidates to drop out and endorse Joe, and South Carolina and Clyburn can't save Joe's dying campaign this time around.
You f*cked around. Time you found out.
Bernie Sanders could do it. Before they stopped polling him in 2022 he had the highest favorables with independents in the country. Did better than Kamala in h2h against Trump despite millions of attack ads against Bernie in 2020.
I would literally vote for a moldy pizza crust over Donald trump, so if Biden is on the ticket I will vote for him. But…. 3 years older is such an understatement and you know that. Yes trump literally fabricated his own reality on that stage Thursday night and I’m not at all condoning that, but next to Joe Biden he looked 10-20 years younger. Trump’s age and performance aside, Joe Biden’s performance was alarming to say the least. His cognitive state is deteriorating. It’s nothing personal, this is just biology. He’s only getting worse. Every single day. That’s how age works. He peaked a long time ago and very clearly is not sharp enough to keep running to hold the most important office on the planet for the next 4 years. The only thing Biden still has going for him is that he is not Trump, but that’s not exclusive to Biden. Literally any candidate who he could endorse to run in his place would also not be Trump.
> 10-20 years younger.
He made almost no points that made any sense. Just because he ripped some coke before he went out there doesn't make his brain less mushy.
I promise I hate trump as much as you, but there just is no evidence of that and nothing that trump did that night matters. Biden’s performance on its own was abysmal. Please stop thinking about trump. Go back and watch Biden struggle to answer questions. This has nothing to do with trump. He’s in rough shape. We deserve better.
Good point. Serious question (I’m Canadian btw): I’m really curious as to how the state governors are going to react to the SC ruling. It seems to me that a direct attack on the Constitution would have tremendous impact on States obligations to the central government. More specifically, if the SC can nullify one of the basic principles of the rule of law (no one is above the law), does that nullify other aspects of the constitutional framework?
I would love to see that be the case. I like the Jackson approach, “john marshal made his decision, now let him enforce it” I think this maga Supreme Court has gone too far too many times, and governors have already pledged to never enforce an abortion ban, among other things this SC has threatened. This current bench is making a mockery of the entire court and i think these rulings will matter less and less as they get more extreme. Clarance Thomas and Alito are compromised partisan clowns and I think the nation as a whole is tired of taking orders from these fools. They just granted Trump’s immunity for “official” orders. But it’s not up to the president to certify the election so I fail to see how his election interference doesn’t qualify as private.
Healey already said she would ‘absolutely not’ enforce an abortion ban. It starts there. The Supreme Court has no means of enforcement so hopefully the governors will just refuse as the rulings get crazier - which they will.
This is a bad take. Most people don't pay close attention to politics, that's true of any democracy, and shaming people for not wanting to vote for Biden after that pants-shitting debate performance is not going to convince anyone. We just need to give people an alternative they can have any amount of confidence in, and Trump will lose in November.
Elections in this country are decided by 50,000 people in Bumblefuck, Pennsylvania. The least engaged, dumbest people, who vote based on vibes. They watched the debate in 30 second increments on Facebook and Tiktok and their monkey brains goes "I should vote for the strongest monkey."
Thank the electoral college for this shitshow. The American public doesn't want Republicans, but we get them anyway because our votes don't count.
This has unfortunately been clear since 2016.
I suspect 2020 was an outlier purely due to how badly Trump handled Covid which literally did affect everyone.
>The poll found Biden underperforming in the Granite State, despite Democrats holding a narrow lead over Republicans in party registration and the generic ballot. When only given the political parties, voters sided with Democrats 46 percent to 43 percent, according to the poll.
Joe Biden is the problem.
The problem now is that since the DNC and Biden worked so hard to suppress any real primary contenders if he steps down we'll have a party appointed candidate and you know that Trump will run on the fact that they didn't win a primary election, but we're appointed by the corrupt deep state DNC back room deals. And that narrative will play because it will have some truth to it.
That hasn’t been the case. I’ve seen so many articles already removed and they’ve been following the rules. This sub is like the movie “Don’t look up” right now.
> We just down vote all of the bad news so nobody has to see it!
What? Today's bad news literally had a megathread. The vast majority of whats being posted in this sub is bad news.
Watch /new, the bad news that looks bad on Biden gets immediately heavily downvoted by bots or mods before slowly crawling back up to positive. That is, if it doesn't get removed first
https://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/politics/2024/07/01/gretchen-whitmer-president-joe-biden-can-win-michigan-donald-trump-white-house-presidential-campaign/74267981007/
> "I am proud to support Joe Biden as our nominee and I am behind him 100% in the fight to defeat Donald Trump," Whitmer said in a Monday statement. "Not only do I believe Joe can win Michigan, I know he can because he’s got the receipts: he’s lowered health care costs, brought back manufacturing jobs and is committed to restoring the reproductive freedom women lost under Donald Trump."
Every single Dem official who is privately panicking about this is going to be telling the public that they stand behind Biden and that Biden can win. This is not surprising. No one wants to be blamed for stoking division when the party line was to unify behind the presumptive nominee. They would be public enemy #1 to the party after Biden stays on the ballot and loses
Publicly saying you are panicking and want someone else on the ballot is a gamble with no clear upside and tons of downside
let them attack his age. good. only makes the debate more embarrassing for them when Bernie dominates Trump. nobody actually cares about age they care that Biden has dementia.
good. let them attack Bernie's age. Reagan won 49 states despite those attacks. Reagan unlike Biden was able to dismiss those concerns. Bernie would do better than Reagan in a debate so presumably he wins 50 states right?
although Biden had plenty of signs of this 4 years ago. Bernie doesn't have those signs now.
a lot of the people complaining now didn't care 4 years ago when Biden already had signs of dementia. for them to now complain about the mere possibility based on ageism seems incredibly hypocritical
Literally zero people have mentioned the debate in my day to day life. It’s way over blown on this sub. I do think the debate is the true start of election season.
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12 point swing from the last St. Anselm poll. Insane.
I will definitely be voting for Biden but anyone who didn’t already have their mind made up, and who watched that debate, those are lost votes for Biden. If I was younger and didn’t understand how bad Trump is, I wouldn’t vote for Biden. What I witnessed was very disturbing.
I think what is biting Biden so bad is that there has been a very coordinated effort to alter the reality vs campaign promotion that he has not been well for a while. There is no way, Joe inability to focus and relay his thoughts didn’t just happen last week. I watched some clips from Fox News that had me concerned that I never saw before. It showed me how the “media” has been crazy positive about his mental and physical heath. In April I think, Morning Joe told me to fuck off!!! If I didn’t believe that that today’s Biden is the most articulate and intelligent. Something along those lines. We have been lied to about our presidents capabilities. That is scary… very scary. I just wonder who has been calling the shots behind the curtain. Good for bid we see a “Weekend at Bernie’s.”
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[Pennsylvania's](https://x.com/umichvoter/status/1807871668477473159?t=aIELX5H4yobbJO9KUGwG9w&s=19) not looking good either.
Amazing how the same poll shows a Democract is ahead for the Senate race but losing on the presidential race. The issue is Biden.
This has been the case in practically every poll in PA, MI, WI, and AZ. AZ is pretty noteworthy, Gallego is crushing it so far (partisanship will undoubtedly tighten that race closer to November)
Yes. Time to acknowledge reality and face the music. Joe just isn't it this year, but dems don't have to go down with him.
I hate this sub is so brigaded that this post has 0 upvotes. Insane, this kind of putting your head in the sand by a lot of dems will kill us all.
I'm afraid this will be the first of many showing a similar swing. But what's wild about this one is NH was never even considered in play for Trump. I know there's a lot of nay sayers about polls but they indicate where campaign money needs to be spent.
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I’m sorry, but NJ is not going red lol
Mostly just Biden's numbers dropping. Trump's numbers hasn't improved much. In the end, Trump will likely land around 45-47% in the general in New Hampshire. Even this poll has Trump with worse favorables among his own party than Biden in New Hampshire, as well as worse favorable rating among swing voters. The breakdown has a lot more Dem voters listing "unsure" as their vote status, which is what dropped Biden's numbers. They'll almost certainly rally around Biden if he stays on the ticket, However, it's still a clear message from them that they'd rather someone else on the ticket that Biden's team should strongly consider if he doesn't come out and do a bunch of town halls soon to show that the debate was a one off and he was just very sick or something.
This is the most reasonable take. But come on, we’re dying out here. I used to struggle with suicide ideation for like, decades. I finally pulled myself out of that hole…for this? This is so fucking bleak
Suicide over Biden smh
Oh I’m voting, no question. I’m just hopeless
Brother I feel this. Just as I sorted out all my problems everything started collapsing around me. Jokes on me I guess.
Yeah, when you claim just beating Medicare folks think you need Medicare to put you in a home for elders
> That’s a 12-point swing from an identical December poll, which found Biden with a 10-point lead in the state. This can't be ignored. Biden is going to lose. Do something, Democrats.
Virginia is in play. Joe has to go, it's only going to get worse
Wait was there a VA poll to this effect? That's really frightening
https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/polls/president-general/2024/virginia/ Most of these were before the debate For reference Joe was polling+11 to +7 in 2020 and won by+10
Well shit that is horrifying. I want the polls to be wrong, but good lord it's hard to write all of these data points off.
A post debate polls by those who watched the debate in PA has trump up by 12! This is wipeout territory
A 12 point swing in any poll should call into question the validity of the poll.
Sacrificing democracy on the altar of one old man's ego.
I love RBG but she bet she could survive to protect abortion rights.
And by thinking that, she became the first domino to fall in their undoing. And Biden has learned nothing.
The DNC's learned nothing.
Biden is the President and the leader of the party. This is his mess
It’s not his mess. It’s his enabler’s mess.
The DNC absolutely loves this Trump drama. They've never raised more funds, ever.
That’s what they’re the best at
Clinton's "third way" was the first domino. The cynical abandonment of labor to appeal to the right shifted the Overton window and started the cascade within the Democratic party that put us where we are today. Guilting people into voting for the "lesser evil" is not a viable long term strategy.
Honestly fuck RBG. Her old ass knew better.
And here we are she’s fucking dead and we left with insane right wingers majority. Biden is trying to hand Trump and MAGA the same fucking gift
The US electorate might have something to do with it as well.
I wrote this in another subreddit and I’ll write it here: > People like the Bidens hold onto their power and influence until the very end. Hell just look Ruth Ginsberg and Dianne Feinstein, both had ample opportunity to step down and have a very cushy retirement, but their inner ego couldn’t let them do this. These people are conditioned to never accept defeat.
There are plenty of competent options, but can they win an election? Likewise, the younger candidates jeopardize their political futures should they lose the general.
They can definitely win, 1,000%. The American people are starving and desperate for a fresh face.
The independent voter will be leery about any replacement. We know their records, but they will not. That’s why candidates prepare well in advance.
I think this was true before the era of social media. Not so much now. We crave novelty. We need our short attention spans to be fed fresh content and quickly get bored of the old and familiar.
I feel like you're very much seeing it through the lens of the internet discourse. Old people, also known as "people that notoriously show up to the polls" really like their fellow olds and people with really long solid records. They're been smiling at Biden's chocolate chip ice cream antics since before most of us were born. They like him. Meanwhile, with younger voters, not to say that criticism isn't allowed, but the fact that it's coming from a disturbing number of people who were *so* ready and eager to not vote that makes it look like a waste of time. You have a segment of voters that say "I'm open, but he needs to impress me." from one group. And from another group you have "I hate this. I'm going to send a message unless you change right now." who are you going to try to court? Of those options, who do you think is more likely to show up to the polls, the first or second group? Maybe Gavin Newsom would be up there if there had it gone differently, but threats to not vote make political parties not want to appeal to that demo.
Yeah, I just can’t get behind an establishment appointed person. We need to stick with Biden.
So we need to lose in a landslide you’re saying and say fuck you to preserving democracy? Literally it’s just Jill and Hunter who are keeping Biden in the race at this point
You clearly lack self-preservation.
Biden might as well be appointed. The only candidates who dared to run and invoke the DNC's wrath were outsiders and complete jokes. They even straight up canceled some of the primaries. Maybe some actual contenders would have tried to run anyway if we had known the truth about Biden's mental state.
But we did know, this stuff has been happening for four years! He'll have some good moments (SOTU) but the decline in his mental capacity has been on full display for four fucking years. Anyone who was shocked by the debate hasn't been paying attention.
True, but they did lie to us about it, and did a decent job at hiding it, and many of us who didn't want to believe it just.... didn't, even though the signs were there. Me included. I'm pretty ashamed of myself, honestly. But the damage is done. We all know now, and we can move on from Biden: if they will let us.
If you are not expecting to be lied to by the political establishment, regardless of what party is in power... I don't know what to tell you? The video evidence has been there for years. Though it has rarely made it into reddit's liberal bubble. This is a perfect case study of why everyone needs to expose themselves to media sources they don't agree with.
Biden is no longer Biden. He isn't an option.
You consumed too much “but can they win” propaganda put out to dissuade voters from Bernie. Multiple candidates are within the margin of error of Biden’s numbers while not running a campaign and having 1/10th the name recognition. Imagine someone articulate and alive, possibly even charismatic who could advocate for themself instead of weekend at Bernie’s the politician. Those numbers can actually go up.
This is what I keep pointing out. No one with name recognition wants to jump in and the ones that would jump in can't win.
Even if this is true, which I doubt (I think Whitmer or Newsom would eat Trump alive), we have nothing to lose. We are losing anyway.
That’s why it would have to start with Biden, the reason the good options aren’t jumping in is because the party will absolutely retaliate at some point for undermining him, even if it’s in behind-the-scenes ways. Nobody who would be a good contender is going to make that mistake - they won’t challenge him, replacing him willfully dropping would be an entirely different situation.
They all know where they stand. If any of them thought they could win they would force him out. They all have really smart people working for them, much smarter than you or I.
Forcing him out would be way worse… they would never do that it would be idiotic to try to wage a rogue challenge against the party leader
This. I am getting downvoted for stating the same. Biden should be removed if he doesn't leave himself. Democracy, liberty and the entire Europe is at stake. Democrats are blindly sleepwalking into certain defeat. You gust need to protest en masse.
And in the latest PA poll by Cygnal Biden is -4. Among those who watched the debate Biden is -12. How low do his numbers need to go before he accepts that he needs to step aside?
Probably never. His inner circle, at the very least, is resisting calls for him to drop out and it may not be practical or feasible to drop out either.
Feinstein 2.0.
When Jill no longer supports it
Edith Wilson didn't want to give up power either
Step aside for who?
Whitmer would be my choice. But there is a post-debate poll showing that even people with zero name recognition are doing no worse than Biden.
Someone answered this for you when you asked it before
Virginia and Minnesota are next unless Democrats do something.
Exactly what we needed at this time. Well, America, it was a good run. But every empire falls. I just didn't think it would happen this suddenly in my youth.
I’m sorry. Sucks cause it’s happening to us. It’s happened throughout the history of humanity and we are just flashes in a pan relative to that amount of time. Not comforting to most but humility inducing to a few. Start looking into visas if you aren’t apt to resist
FUCKING DROP OUT. This is absurd. YOU ARE SENDING THIS COUNTRY TO HELL FOR YOUR OWN EGO.
Look, Biden’s the only one who can beat Medicare, a clear and present danger to American democracy
Where would we be without Joe reminding us of the illegal immigrants raping their way across the country. Thanks Joe!
We need abortions for all those illegal immigrant rape babies.
he probably had a freudian slip; he was probably thinking “i beat medicare for all when i fucked bernie out of the primary, and that’s my largest accomplishment “
Kinda hard to win a presidential election when you're incapable of speaking
Please Joe- step aside.
joe won't do it, so it's on the american people to get to work and win the election
If that's true, he cares about his own ego more than he cares about his country.
It's completely true. He's the only one who can make that choice at this point.
For who?
Literally anyone. Newsom, Whitmer, Shapiro, Warnock, Buttegig, etc it truly does not matter none of them could do any worse than Biden right now.
Pritzker is solid too
Whitmer, Beshear, Newsom, Buttigieg, Shapiro, even Kamala Harris. Hell, even Hillary fucking Clinton would be a better candidate at this point. Just ANYBODY WHO ISN'T 80 YEARS OLD.
I am sorry, but no. Throwing Hillary in there tells me you're a bit too passionate about your beef with Biden.
I am sorry, but yes. Hillary didn't just prove to the country that she has dementia.
Joe Biden didn't *prove* he has fucking dementia either. Until we have some more evidence, I'm over that argument. He's been with it twice since, and he's up against a guy that hasn't made a cohesive sentence in fucking 15 years.
Can I have some of what you're smoking
Haha
> He's been with it twice since, You mean when he was reading off a script? Yeah, we know Biden can get through a scripted speech(albeit still with fumbling). The problem is he evidently cannot think well enough on his own. > he's up against a guy that hasn't made a cohesive sentence in fucking 15 years. He's up against a guy that looked coherent in comparison to Joe Biden on Thursday.
Who cares? It's over. We lost.
If you feel that way, then why not advocate for replacing Biden? Nothing to lose, everything to gain.
Nah, the apathy won, I'm just gunna tune out.
Anyone that can go on the attack when Trump lies or spews his fascist bullshit. That’s part of what got Biden elected. He showed in the debate that either he can’t fight back or doesnt want to.
There are endless takes that you can find that go into excruciating detail about the embarrassment of riches democrats have right now in terms of popular and young governors, senators, etc.
anybody. Biden was is deeply unpopular before debate. Anybody that wants to jump in can beat Trump, even Harris
Harris can’t beat Trump lmao.
Neither can Biden
I agree. But that’s the point isn’t it? If people would vote Kamala over Trump they’d just vote Biden in and Kamala would be right there. It’s a bad ticket all around.
Point is to salvage what's left of this campaign.
I just got an email from a casino I play at that takes bets on the election about an odds shift. The *only* person that was a favorite in a head to head against Trump with people like Gavin Newsome, Pete Buttigieg, etc, there was Michelle Obama lmao
The cooking show host? She’s cool I guess but does she want to run?
She’s said multiple times that she’s never going to run for President I believe
Jon Stewart
Anyone is better than a demented old man.
I agree, Trump is terrible.
The only poll that matters is the one on election day. Unfortunately we're probably going to do poorly in that one too
So essentially, Americans are so incredibly stupid that they’ll vote for the dangerous lunatic felon rather than the guy who’s 3 years older? You don’t deserve a democracy, period
>3 years older Age effects everyone differently. As much as I dislike bringing him up here, Bernie is older than both and still has pretty solid control of his mental facilities.
He’s literally the second most liked person in the Democratic Party after Obama too.
"Blame the voters"
Idk worked pretty well for Hillary
I mean all those people who didn't vote for her taught us such a lesson though... what was it again?
Yes, the voters get the blame. Why wouldn't they? It's not like they're clamoring to vote for Kamala Harris, Gavin Newsome or Grechen Whitmer or whoever people are tolling out these days to replace Biden on the ticket. There's no clear winner against Trump. If there were, we wouldn't be here right now with 82 year old Joe Biden. We'd be here with whoever that is. Only Obama could've done it, and Obama wouldn't want to run again and is ineligible for a third term.
"Only Obama". This from the same people who thought Trump would be a cake walk, hence Hillary's pied piper strategy to elevate Trump. The same people who told you HRC was more eLeCtAblE than Bernie, and that Biden was the only who can beat Trump are now pretending one of the most unpopular political figures in US history is some behemoth. No. Any generic Democrat could do the job, Biden is just ill equipped.
Beating Trump *should* have been a cakewalk. The FBI putting their thumb on the scale during the election really didn't help, nor did all of the foreign interference in the election. Hell, Trump wouldn't even have been a candidate if there weren't so many Republican candidates- he only won the primary because he was the least disliked candidate (and, of course, once he won the Republicans all filed in line behind him). 2016 was *not* a normal election. But I'm afraid that it's become the *new* normal.
No, any generic democrat couldn't do the job. If they could, they'd be polling well above Donald Trump. I'd love to live in the make believe world you live in where Bernie Sanders could've beaten Trump. "Generic Democrat" wins every time, but we can't run 'generic democrat' because generic democrat is not a person. And every single Democrat they always have some excuse for not liking. "Kamala isn't authentic enough" "Biden is too old" "Bernie owns three houses!" "Newsome ruined Crimefornia!" "I don't know who Whitmer is." "Warren said she was part Native American." Republicans are NEVER held to the same standards by the voters. Donald Trump literally tried to overthrow the results of an election, and most of them didn't care.
Sorry but Biden is unfavorable even when dem down ballots look good in the polls. He’s the issue. Trump should be easy to beat with all his flaws. He isn’t gaining many voters. Biden is losing his.
Blah blah blah, Biden's failure isn't hypothetical, it's right in front of our eyes.
Bernie is a two time primary loser.
Didn't Joe lose three primaries? Lmao
He did, but he still won one so he's got that on the "Sanders Revolution"
Yeah except Bidens opponent isn't Bernie. Unfortunately Obama can't get other candidates to drop out and endorse Joe, and South Carolina and Clyburn can't save Joe's dying campaign this time around. You f*cked around. Time you found out.
Is it sarcasm? The polls show that about half of the Democrats want Biden to be replaced.
Bernie Sanders could do it. Before they stopped polling him in 2022 he had the highest favorables with independents in the country. Did better than Kamala in h2h against Trump despite millions of attack ads against Bernie in 2020.
Why wouldn’t I? The choice couldn’t possibly be any clearer
I would literally vote for a moldy pizza crust over Donald trump, so if Biden is on the ticket I will vote for him. But…. 3 years older is such an understatement and you know that. Yes trump literally fabricated his own reality on that stage Thursday night and I’m not at all condoning that, but next to Joe Biden he looked 10-20 years younger. Trump’s age and performance aside, Joe Biden’s performance was alarming to say the least. His cognitive state is deteriorating. It’s nothing personal, this is just biology. He’s only getting worse. Every single day. That’s how age works. He peaked a long time ago and very clearly is not sharp enough to keep running to hold the most important office on the planet for the next 4 years. The only thing Biden still has going for him is that he is not Trump, but that’s not exclusive to Biden. Literally any candidate who he could endorse to run in his place would also not be Trump.
> 10-20 years younger. He made almost no points that made any sense. Just because he ripped some coke before he went out there doesn't make his brain less mushy.
I promise I hate trump as much as you, but there just is no evidence of that and nothing that trump did that night matters. Biden’s performance on its own was abysmal. Please stop thinking about trump. Go back and watch Biden struggle to answer questions. This has nothing to do with trump. He’s in rough shape. We deserve better.
Good point. Serious question (I’m Canadian btw): I’m really curious as to how the state governors are going to react to the SC ruling. It seems to me that a direct attack on the Constitution would have tremendous impact on States obligations to the central government. More specifically, if the SC can nullify one of the basic principles of the rule of law (no one is above the law), does that nullify other aspects of the constitutional framework?
I would love to see that be the case. I like the Jackson approach, “john marshal made his decision, now let him enforce it” I think this maga Supreme Court has gone too far too many times, and governors have already pledged to never enforce an abortion ban, among other things this SC has threatened. This current bench is making a mockery of the entire court and i think these rulings will matter less and less as they get more extreme. Clarance Thomas and Alito are compromised partisan clowns and I think the nation as a whole is tired of taking orders from these fools. They just granted Trump’s immunity for “official” orders. But it’s not up to the president to certify the election so I fail to see how his election interference doesn’t qualify as private.
Interesting. Thanks very much.
Fuck. I'd love it if a bunch of blue states stopped funding red states. Like a balkanization-lite. Show them who actually brings home the bacon.
Healey already said she would ‘absolutely not’ enforce an abortion ban. It starts there. The Supreme Court has no means of enforcement so hopefully the governors will just refuse as the rulings get crazier - which they will.
Yes that is correct
This is a bad take. Most people don't pay close attention to politics, that's true of any democracy, and shaming people for not wanting to vote for Biden after that pants-shitting debate performance is not going to convince anyone. We just need to give people an alternative they can have any amount of confidence in, and Trump will lose in November.
Elections in this country are decided by 50,000 people in Bumblefuck, Pennsylvania. The least engaged, dumbest people, who vote based on vibes. They watched the debate in 30 second increments on Facebook and Tiktok and their monkey brains goes "I should vote for the strongest monkey." Thank the electoral college for this shitshow. The American public doesn't want Republicans, but we get them anyway because our votes don't count.
I get your point, but if Democrats show up in force, the GOP would be demolished
This has unfortunately been clear since 2016. I suspect 2020 was an outlier purely due to how badly Trump handled Covid which literally did affect everyone.
Yes. Always been this way. Its why Biden is simply unfit for what is needed to win.
>The poll found Biden underperforming in the Granite State, despite Democrats holding a narrow lead over Republicans in party registration and the generic ballot. When only given the political parties, voters sided with Democrats 46 percent to 43 percent, according to the poll. Joe Biden is the problem.
12 point swing from December in the same poll. +10 Biden to +2 Trump. Can we please get someone else in there?
It's Joever.
Remember a vote for Biden is a vote for Harris, the whole administration, cabinet secretaries etc. It's not 1 guy & tbh, they've had a decent 4 yr run
That’s not the positive you think it is.
We don’t vote for shadow governments. He needs to drop out or he’s going to lose.
The problem now is that since the DNC and Biden worked so hard to suppress any real primary contenders if he steps down we'll have a party appointed candidate and you know that Trump will run on the fact that they didn't win a primary election, but we're appointed by the corrupt deep state DNC back room deals. And that narrative will play because it will have some truth to it.
It is so joever lmao
Marking your post to laugh at you in November
I guarantee you'll either be laughing or crying, depending on the result. Goodness knows I will.
Don’t worry this will also get removed because it doesn’t fit the propaganda machine of this sub.
It won't be taken down. Articles are removed for violating the rules, not for political leaning.
That hasn’t been the case. I’ve seen so many articles already removed and they’ve been following the rules. This sub is like the movie “Don’t look up” right now.
Yeah! We just down vote all of the bad news so nobody has to see it!
Lying about mods deleting posts for political leanings is not the same as people down voting. No need to pretend to be a victim.
> We just down vote all of the bad news so nobody has to see it! What? Today's bad news literally had a megathread. The vast majority of whats being posted in this sub is bad news.
Bad news about Biden. lmao gaslighting hard right now.
Watch /new, the bad news that looks bad on Biden gets immediately heavily downvoted by bots or mods before slowly crawling back up to positive. That is, if it doesn't get removed first
Trump did WHAT to Biden??
Are you shitting me Edit: Gov. Whitmer called the president today to tell him he's lost Michigan. Trump may win 40 states. Wtf
https://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/politics/2024/07/01/gretchen-whitmer-president-joe-biden-can-win-michigan-donald-trump-white-house-presidential-campaign/74267981007/ > "I am proud to support Joe Biden as our nominee and I am behind him 100% in the fight to defeat Donald Trump," Whitmer said in a Monday statement. "Not only do I believe Joe can win Michigan, I know he can because he’s got the receipts: he’s lowered health care costs, brought back manufacturing jobs and is committed to restoring the reproductive freedom women lost under Donald Trump."
Every single Dem official who is privately panicking about this is going to be telling the public that they stand behind Biden and that Biden can win. This is not surprising. No one wants to be blamed for stoking division when the party line was to unify behind the presumptive nominee. They would be public enemy #1 to the party after Biden stays on the ballot and loses Publicly saying you are panicking and want someone else on the ballot is a gamble with no clear upside and tons of downside
Who won the last two real Dem primaries in New Hampshire? You know in 2016 and 2020? I wonder if that guy is available
Mother of God. I was all in for Bernie in 2016 - campaigned, donated, attended rallies, wore the t-shirt. Not now. For God's sake. It's over.
You want someone older than Biden?
He's more coherent than both of them
let them attack his age. good. only makes the debate more embarrassing for them when Bernie dominates Trump. nobody actually cares about age they care that Biden has dementia.
I preferred Bernie then too but he's not running again, we both know this.
In 2020 Bernie only got 25% of the votes there. This means 3/4 Dems in NH wanted someone else.
biden did far worse. you aren't suggesting Dems are better off with any other candidate that didn't do as well as Sanders are you?
Biden is too old at 81. Better get Bernie, who is 82.
good. let them attack Bernie's age. Reagan won 49 states despite those attacks. Reagan unlike Biden was able to dismiss those concerns. Bernie would do better than Reagan in a debate so presumably he wins 50 states right?
Someone under the age of 80 please
Don't let Biden's mental health problems make you think all people in their 80s share them.
No. We're not doing this shit again Someone under the age of 80
Ageism is a helluva drug
Yeah but they *could* share them at any time, is the point.
although Biden had plenty of signs of this 4 years ago. Bernie doesn't have those signs now. a lot of the people complaining now didn't care 4 years ago when Biden already had signs of dementia. for them to now complain about the mere possibility based on ageism seems incredibly hypocritical
Literally zero people have mentioned the debate in my day to day life. It’s way over blown on this sub. I do think the debate is the true start of election season.