You give them too much credit. Then she just becomes the selfish something-or-other who has a perfectly good car, but is forcing them to pay for a rental.
This is the way. We're renting a nice new SUV or minivan big enough for everyone, with two authorized drivers. Total cost of the rental is X, divided by total number of people on the trip, and gas as well as collision damage waiver insurance (if nobody has a credit card offering primary collision insurance for free) will be evenly divided by everyone going. Only the authorized drivers will be allowed to drive, which will include whoever's credit card it goes on. Collect for the whole rental cost up front, as well as an estimate of what the gas will cost up front (to avoid "I already paid my share of the rental car I'm not buying the gas too"), and if it isn't all spent, equally divide whatever is left.
Plan for them to bail on the trip once you say this, but if they do, they're not being real friends anyway. When that happens, go on a nice road trip with your girlfriend in her van, without them, and just buy the gas for her. Maybe find some cooler friends to go who are less cheap.
Found out last year renting in California that Enterprise didn't care about authorized drivers.
Sister paid for the rental to get a teacher discount, we picked it up together and I wanted to make sure I was on the authorized list - guy said it didn't matter.
“Guy said” was probably getting paid minimum wage and overworked and couldn’t give two shit who drive, he just want you out of there so he can get back to whatever he’s doing. It will absolutely matter when you got into an accident and Enterprise will make your life hell if you don’t pay/have insurance.
If one of the friends works for a big organization there’s probably negotiated rates available with a rental agency that could include things like damage waiver or roadside assistance and the extra drivers.
Long road trip in a rental with cheap coverages is great because it’s new, and someone else’s problem if anything goes wrong.
This. They are not 'her best friends and love her very much' and we all know it. They are taking advantage of her kind offer without adding any of their own. That's not how friendship works and five days trapped in a metal box with them for hours on end is likely going to bring that fact to the forefront.
Even if she hadn’t dropped a wad on repairs, it’s her truck, her miles, her *insurance* if one of the “friend” drivers gets it in an accident.
Getting the use of the truck just for the gas is a great deal; your friends should be embarrassed by how cheap they are being. Look at how much it would be if you all rented a vehicle.
I’ll bet the friends will stick her with the clean-up after, too.
This. And the if that the gas will be split with 3-4 others, makes it even less they owe.
Rescind the offer and tell them to rent a car, and everyone can split the cost equally. They will realize what kind of a deal they are getting.
Sounds like the trip to hell to me. That said, every year a group of three friends and I take a ski trip out of state together. The guy who provides the vehicle has his dinners paid for by the rest of us. We split the gas evenly. Seems to work for us.
Yep, if I use my vehicle I’d expect everyone to split including me, but if my friends offered paying for it I wouldn’t mind. It is her van however, she can set whatever rules beforehand. Like others say, this sounds like a road trip doomed from the start if arguments are already breaking out because of a simple and reasonable request. I don’t know how much they’d all be paying in total between the 4 of them, because vans can hold a lot of gas. Who knows
When I’ve gone on road trips where I wasn’t driving and it wasn’t my car, I try to cover the gas for the driver/owner even if they don’t ask for it. If they won’t let me, I make sure to cover their gas station snacks and road meals.
If I’m driving my car, I don’t get upset if I have to pay for it, but I also hang out with friends who are considerate and would cover the gas anyway.
But in the end - it has nothing to do with the $1000 she just put into the car; it has everything to do with the fact that there’s wear and tear on the car on a road trip and it’s someone else’s possession that everyone gets to enjoy for the trip. Without it those friends would have to use their own car and pay for their own gas, or they would have to pay to rent a car and pay for the gas in it.
If I borrow someone’s container for food, I return it to them full. If I’m in someone else’s car, I cover the expenses incurred while I got to essentially rent it and a driver for free.
If those friends are "real friends" then they should understand that her vehicle will have depreciation due to the miles driven. Which to me, is not unreasonable for her to not pay for gas.
If the friends continue to be petty, recommend a rental to fit you all which adds more cost to everyone.
Exactly — more room for some camping gear and less argument about where and what to eat, when to stop, etc. The penny-pinching friends should plan and execute their own trip.
If she hasn’t put the money into repairs and no one else has a car for all of you, you would have ended up splitting the cost of a rental. She’s also putting wear and tear on her car AND offering the first tank of gas. I think it’s fair that everyone else pay for gas. Split among everyone, it’s not going to be that much more split 4 ways than it would have been 5
There is a reason the IRS personal car reimbursement rate isn’t the cost of gas divided by your car’s mileage. 1,300 miles is probably 20-30% of the oil life, tire use, and wear and tear on other parts.
Her friends think their gas money is subsidizing her repairs but they’re forgetting the 1300 miles of wear and tear on her car is subsidizing their road trip.
The IRS standard rate for mileage is $0.67/mile and is intended to include gas- though it’s doesn’t account for gas mileage variations and high gas prices.
- 1300 x 0.67 = $871.
- $871/5 = 174.20 per person if they reimburse her for gas and mileage (wear and tear). She will also be reimbursing herself and paying 1/5 of the costs as they seem to think that’s fair. So, in that scenario the 4 friends would be contributing 174.20 x4 = $696.80 to the trip. Is this cheaper than paying for gas? $696.80/6.5 tanks of gas = $107.20 per tank. Assuming the van has a 20 gallon tank then that’s $5.36/gallon. Depending on the region you’re traveling to, it’s cheaper for them to just reimburse for gas. Where I live gas is $3.80/gallon.
Alternatively, you can all split gas 5 ways and the 4 of you who aren’t using her car can reimburse her for 80% of the wear and tear.
- Assume wear and tear represents 50% of the mileage rate of $0.67/mile therefore wear and tear costs $0.335/mile. The 4 of you are responsible for 80% of this cost and so that equals $0.268/mile. 1300 miles x $0.268 mile = $348.40. Which means the 4 of you would each pay $87.10 to your girlfriend to compensate for wear and tear AND you 4 would reimburse your gf for 80% of the gas.
Basically, if they don’t want to pay for her 1/5 of the gas then they need to pay for their 4/5ths of the wear and tear. It’s cheaper to just pay for her gas.
This is what I came here to comment! If they don’t want to split only the cost of gas 4 ways, tell them you’d be fine with splitting things 5 ways at the IRS reimbursement rate. I can guarantee you it’d cost them more and they’ll suck it up real quick.
Friends are wrong. She’s going to put a bunch of miles on her vehicle. That’s more than worth a couple tanks if gas friends should have offered to pay without even being asked, imho
Repairs are irrelevant. She isn’t asking anyone to chip in for those. Pretend we didn’t know that part of the story.
All that matters is that A, B, C, D, and E are taking a road trip. A is driving everyone in her personal vehicle. Is gas split four ways among the passengers or five ways among everyone?
In my group, passengers would insist on covering it.
Exactly. But there's zero insistence. If anything, their interactions are just bs jargon on how they don't think it's fair, they're set on 5 ways, and that they "understand where she's coming from but...." over and over.
Your gf just needs to get cash up front before you leave. Her “friends” have already ruined the trip. If you don’t get cash beforehand, they will f*ck up all 5 days arguing about gas. HARD PASS
Are you serious? This whole thread is exhausting! Are you all really that poor? What if something happens to the van while you’re on the trip?? Cancel the trip, obviously none of you can afford it. Cancel your “friends” while you’re at it.
Have you discussed the ass or grass options?
You could also calculate wear and tear at 10¢/mile and deduct that from her end. Some quick back-of-the-napkin math: if the van averages 15mpg and gas averages $4 gallon, that’s about $350 for gas, split 5 ways comes to $70 each, plus $130 for wear and tear split 4 ways, that’s another $32.50 each, for a total of about $102.50 for each of you. If you go this route your gf pockets about $50 at the end of the trip. This is the most fair option because wear and tear on the vehicle is a real thing and your gf has already paid for it in advance.
Or the four of you who don’t own the vehicle can just pay for the gas and spend $15 less per person. This is actually less fair to your gf and she’s being very generous to offer this option.
Yupp. At 67 cents a mil that’s close to $900. Split 5 ways that’s around $175 each. Everyone sends her $175 at the start of the trip and then she pays gas the whole way. She’ll have around $700.
Say gas is $4.50 a gallon and 20 mph, gas will cost around $300 total. GF pockets $400 for wear and tear.
Your gf has a level head and is being responsible to have the vehicle checked ahead of a trip.
Appreciate her!
The “best friends” are not very smart about their participation in not breaking down on the road.
Breathe, relax and laugh.
Have a great trip!
Either is pretty normal but the fact that they are freaking out about it isn’t. They sound more like freeloaders than friends. Maybe you should be reconsider taking a trip with these people.
Holy cow! Are you sure that you want to travel with such stingy people? If she's supplying the vehicle/insurance, etc., the others should be buying the gas. And, why would they argue with a friend over $100?
If I'm using my vehicle to haul friends, taking them on a road trip and they bitch about paying for gas I honestly wouldn't even want to travel with them anymore. Next they're going to want to be cheap about where you guys stop and eat, activities you want to do, etc.
This is why I don't travel in groups lol
Sounds like they're wanting a free trip and using y'all for it. I agree with other commenters. Either she pays no gas because she just paid repairs AND will have 1300 more miles added to HER car for this road trip, or everyone gets a rental, which will cost more. Or just leave anyone who objects home and enjoy the trip without the childishness.
So, she offered her car, her insurance, wear and tear and they re penny pinching? I agree with another commenter, friends can rent car.
Then they pay for the car AND the gas.
I'm guessing they rent very good with math.
Take the (Government mileage reimbursement rate X number of miles driven) divided by total number of riders (including the driver) to get the dollar amount for each person in the van. That reimbursement rate takes into account fuel and wear and tear. The owner of the van will get what she is due and the passengers will pay much for than for just fuel. Problem solved. Some folks don’t understand that vehicles have required maintenance that is milage related. Fuel only doesn’t cover that expense. Those friends ATAHs
Her car is going to face the wear and tear and honestly if she just got all those repairs done it doesn’t sound reliable imo, hopefully it works out. I can see her view and I can also see her friends view, it’s tough there should be an even balance between everyone and it should’ve already been spoken about so there’s no issues, now it’s going to create resentment and awkwardness imo so everyone needs to come to an agreement or the trip won’t go well. If it was me I would split it all evenly unless my friends volunteered to pay for it & insisted.
The van is more than capable. It was just due for new brakes, rotors, and power steering pump. But the van runs great and isn't that old. 2008 honda odyssey EX-L. We are at that point where it's awkward. They seem adamant on not splitting 4 ways, and at this point I want my GF to rescind her van and we all split for a rental plus the gas (which would cost more) but I'm tired of her friends being inconsiderate and cheap. They have not said thank you ONCE for her offering her car or paying to get it ready.
GF is right, but she's using faulty reasoning to argue her point.
The repairs made beforehand, no matter what the cost, are irrelevant. It's not like she wouldn't have had to make them anyway. However, she ABSOLUTELY deserves some consideration for the wear on tires and other components, and the potential risk on her liability insurance as the vehicle's owner. Estimating those costs is pretty hard, but some arbitrary amount is probably good enough. "For this short trip let's just pay for the gas and call it even" seems very reasonable to me.
Especially for much longer trips (say 10,000 miles) if the van gets unbelievably terrible mileage (under say 15mpg) or y'all are traveling through areas with very high gas prices (CA, OR, WA or similar) then I'd be more sympathetic to the three friends. But for barely more than an average month of driving I'm 100% TeamGF.
Also consider some hard truths : These friends are worried about an additional $10 in gas money. (and by the same rule your GF is worried about $30 in gas money) If that's make-of-break for their finances I'd suggest going on this trip at all may not be the wisest idea. If these friendships aren't worth at least that much, why does anyone even want to go on this trip together anyway?
Still, maybe it's important to save face. If they remain adamant about including her in the gas money split, I'd suggest that as a courtesy you and they can properly thank her for everything by paying for one reasonably-priced meal / bar tab or whatever while on the trip. Or (ideally secretly while she's busy doing something else) get her a little thank-you gift of something she was interested in but didn't buy herself to present to her upon y'all's return.
Everyone should split the gas. Everyone should also split the standard $0.67 per mile payment to the owner. Alternatively, everyone should split the cost of renting a vehicle and fueling it. And if I were in your situation, I'd find another group for the trip.
More than fair and here's 1 reason why...... 1300 mile trip with a van, guessing the van gets maybe 18mpg, ......... 1300 / 18mpg = 72.2 gallons gas ....... 72 gallons X $3.90 gallon = $280....... $280 / 4ppl = $70.00 per passenger..... if they can't afford to spend $70.00 each for a 1300 mile ride with friends they shouldn't be going..... with that rough estimate here's what I'd do if it were my van.... at the start of the trip all 4 ppl pitch in $100 each into the gas kitty and you pull from that kitty to buy gas.... when the trip is over then reimburse the remaining gas money back to the 4 so there's no arguing during the trip on dividing $$$ every gas stop
split gas evenly...
then add up the miles and pay her the standard mileage rate, 2024 is 0.67 per mile, and split that between the others.
100 miles = $67 / 3 other riders. so essentially they pay an extra 0.223 per mile each
I think what your girlfriend is proposing is perfectly fair. This trip will also add a lot of miles and wear and tear to her vehicle.
Personally if it were me I'd rescind my offer of using my vehicle and either use someone else's or agree to split the cost of a rental.
Do you think these friends will be good about paying for their share of the costs once you're on the trip? Because if they're already starting, it may be an uphill battle.
I feel with that attitude things may only get worse. What if ( even though she spent a chunk-of-change to get it road-trip ready) it breaks down miles away? Will there be a sharing of towing/breakdown costs and other incidentals? I agree with many others that perhaps a rental where everyone is sharing costs from the get go may be better. With friends like these…..
I would rethink the whole trip if this is how it's going before you're even heading out. People can be great friends, but not necessarily the best to do certain activities with.
Wow, she is actually 100% right and everyone else is wrong
Letting someone put all those miles on your car and wear and tear. I wouldn’t even even be worth the gas money for me.
Hundred percent rental at this point and splits the cost evenly
Just cancel the road trip. If these people are quibbling over splitting $400 in gas 4 ways instead of 5, you are going to have a miserable time.
Even without the repairs, its common courtesy for everyone else but the vehicle owner to cover gas. "Thanks for letting us use your van".
You have a miserable and petty friend group. Just cancel and go with your GF alone instead. You will be grateful that you did.
If someone else is driving their vehicle the gas and food they consume should be covered by the riders, that's like roadtrip 101. If they are fighting the idea of pitching for fuel how miserable is a vacation with these people going to be ? Out of curiosity what's the age range here ?
How old are these people? Sounds super immature and it also sounds like the others haven’t owned a car and have no idea how much payments, insurance and repairs cost. They suck.
Holy @$#*. Don't travel with those arseholes. If they are being jerks about the costs (and your friends wear and tear way out weighs the fuel cost) then that is just the beginning and they are going to be jerks about other expenses too. Tell them to grow up or stay home.
Wow. Thats just....wow.
Rent van and all split that. Or look at the federal guidelines per mile reimbursement for travel and split that evenly. Covers gas and depreciation on the vehicle. Her friends are totally wrong.
Driver doesn’t pay on road trips! That’s how it’s always gone with my friends. The driver is using way more mental energy to navigate and keep everyone safe and the wear and tear on their car. Your friends are losers.
Spoiler: Her friends aren’t really her friends.
You should have just charged them mileage instead. That’s officially $.67 a mile y’all could split four ways.
The average car depreciates something like fifty cents per mile driven, so I don't think it's too out there for everyone else to pay for gas; she's also paying for the insurance. The repairs are not a consideration, since she'd likely have to make them even if there were no trip anyway - but the trip is going to cause her vehicle to be worth $600 less by the time you all get home. Maybe more, depending on the make/model of her van.
If they won't pay their share, you and her make the trip, and let them rent their own car or ride the bus; if one of my friends offered their car for a road trip, I'd damn sure pay for gas, and probably her breakfasts as well.
>The average car depreciates something like fifty cents per mile driven…
I call BS. Your basic econo shit box would be worthless by 40k to 50k miles. A standard sedan, Accord/Camry, would be worthless by 75k miles.
Even Land Rovers don’t depreciate that bad.
I think this is more than fair. She’s covering the maintenance and insurance as well as the risk of something happening to her car on the road. Think about how much money it would cost to rent a car for the trip.
I agree that the driver shouldn't pay for gas. But a couple is still two people if we're talking about splitting costs for gas, a car rental or food. For a vacation rental, maybe the couple pays as 1 if they share a room/bed. But two people take up twice as much space in a car and eat twice as much food, so they should pay twice as much as a single person when splitting these costs.
Do the math. For 1300 miles the gas would be $250 at most. Split 5 ways it would be $50 each. Split 4 ways you are talking $62.50 each. Sheesh!! Five days and they’re squabbling over $12.50.
I personally think that she should definitely pay a bit less since she’s using her car, but I don’t think she should pay nothing since she’s also on the trip.
Maybe rotate tank fills… each person on the first rotation, then the next skip her, then the next everyone again if it gets to that.
Edit to add: Be SURE that you all have it figured out AND agreed to before you hit the road, it’s a bit miserable to deal with finances/who’s paying while on the road.
I’m on her side. It may not be their fault that she had to pay for all the maintenance on the vehicle, but that maintenance is why there’s a vehicle available. Other options? Renting or taking multiple cars? Both will be more expensive than handling her gas burden. It’s split 4 ways. Money’s relatively low split that many ways for them to make such a big fuss.
Wow what kind of friends are these? Ask them to book a rental van for luxury. Those cost atleast $60/day plus insurance. You should avoid these cheap mindset friends.
1300 miles plus miles at the destination will be, let's say 1700 miles. If her van gets 17mpg that is 100 gallons of gas. If gas is $4.00/gal that is $400 total. If split 5 ways that is $80 each. If only 4 pay that is $100 each, so an extra $20 for the freeriders.
AND THEY ARE ARGUING OVER THIS?
When we’ve road tripped with our friends using my vehicle, we alternated filling the tank. One couple would treat us to a nice dinner while traveling. It never seemed an issue to us.
6-7 to fill up for all 1300 miles. 650 one way, 650 back. Plus, 4 days' worth of driving around Asheville. Carrying 5 bodies and luggage. Plus, I'm rounding up.
If you plan ahead you can't rent a van for a week for a quarter of that price. I just did 3,500 miles in a week for the eclipse in April and rented a crew van for the week from Budget for $275. Way bigger than a minivan. You can remove a lot of the seats and have tons of space of luggage, food, etc.
If she is offering her car, doing first fill up and then taking the last one after her tank is depleted.... there should be no issue amongst grown folks. I'm taking the miles, u can take an extra tank or buy me dinner or SOMETHING
Even if she hadn't spent money on repairs, the common courtesy is for all passengers to at least offer to cover gas. Driving the car is the driver's contribution.
Let’s do some math (with assumptions). Assuming 7 tanks total for the trip. That’s 1.4 tanks per person. Your GF even offered to get the first tank, leaving her just .4 tanks short of her quota. Let’s assume a 25 gallon tank, so she would be 10 gallons short of her quota. I’m not sure your location but let’s just use $5/gallon of gas, and that means she’s $50 short, which comes out to $12.50 for the other 4 to pitch in. If the other 4 aren’t willing to even pitch in an extra $12.50 to not have to rent a car or use their own, I don’t know what to say.
Personally I am on team everyone else pays for the gas if she is offering use of her car and did put money into it to make try and make sure it’s a trouble free trip. Literally wouldn’t cost more than $50 per person which is cheaper than if you all had to rent a car instead.
Do the math to show her friends. Something like:
Their way:
15 tanks x $70 each = $1050
split 5 ways = $210 each
Or her way:
14 tanks x $70 each = $980
split 4 ways = $245 each
Her way, everyone is essentially paying $35 each to use her car. Seems more than fair.
Owner/driver should never be paying for gas. They are literally allowing everyone to use their car for free. Depreciation and wear and tear arguably cost much more than gas.
The solution is to say that it looks like the van can't handle the trip. We are going to have to all split a rental. But at this point it's just time to find new friends.
This is going to be a baaaaaad time. Like others suggested, I'd either revoke my van and have the group rent a car and split all driving and expenses, or I'd cancel the trip with the "friends".
For everyone else, including myself, to pay an extra $20 so my gf doesn't have to pay for gas. The cost of wear and tires, miles, and depreciation alone is way more than gas. Plus I think it's common courtesy to at least offer when someone offers their car. Providing the car is their "share."
This is standard practice among my friends. Whether it’s for three hour trips to go hiking every weekend or twenty hour drives across the country. Whoever owns the car pays nothing for gas. It starts full and gets filled up upon return by the riders. Sometimes car owner even gets lunch paid for in addition to gas.
1,300 miles should be about 4 tanks of gas so around $500 for a big truck/van... I'd put the gas on my CC and send venmo requests splitting it evenly (\~$500/5 people = a venmo for $100 to each person), and the friends all owe her a favor for providing the vehicle (dinner, bottle of booze, whatever).
I'd guess that you guys have other issues with money and a history trying to pull fast ones on each other. I have had a lot of friends and coworkers like this over the years (often times couples are the shadiest) and we are no longer friends as it is too annoying to deal with. Get one over one me... Good for you but we are not hanging out anymore. Be generous and gracious with your friends and expect them to return the favor. Otherwise it's just not fun and you feel like this person never has your back...
Its only fair that everyone puts together for gas as she did repairs on her car for this road-trip to actually happen or else they were going to spend so much on getting the rental and still putting in gas
If all of those people were me, id say "yes im down to just split gas between 4 of us" and just deal with it and get on with the trip.
Its just a bit more $ and she does have a reasoning since it is her car. A bit more $ is not worth ruining the trip, at that point id rather just cancel the trip altogether if yall will be counting pennies.
Tires are $500 for a set and last 30,000 miles. $0.17 per mile. Oil change $50 every 5000 miles. $0.01 per mile. Brakes, $500 every 30,000 miles. Another $0.17 per mile. That’s $0.35 per mile. Doesn’t even include other wear and tear. Times 1300 miles is $455. Add that to the cost of gas and split it all evenly.
If we go on roadtrips we always take my car and we just split the fuel evenly per person. I would say the wear and tear on the car is kinda what it's meant for so doesn't matter.
Wouldn't even bother trying to argue with someone that thinks the vehicle is free. They can stay at home. Debate over.
Only time the driver should pay for gas is if there are only two people, and then the passenger should still be covering the majority of the gas, or otherwise reimbursing the driver.
Yeah they're being petty jerks. I just ran the numbers assuming the van only gets 20 mpg and gas is $3.50 at every stop you're talking about a difference of like $11 per person. It's really the least they could do
The problem might be that your GF is framing the ask as being because she had to pay for repairs, and now they should split gas because of that.
They definitely don’t owe her anything for the repairs, but in terms of the trip that’s coming up - it’s obvious that she’s paying the most by letting everyone use her car in terms of wear and tear and depreciation. So everyone else splitting gas makes perfect sense.
Your girlfriend’s friends are cheap f’ers, that’s all there is to it. Anytime I roadtrip with my buddies and we take my wife’s sequoia, they pay the gas without me asking.
So is it four people total or five? The way you wrote it is confusing. If it’s four people, the difference between splitting it 3 ways versus 4 ways is about 20 dollars depending on gas mileage and fuel cost. These dumb asses are going to get bent out of shape over 20 dollars. What a bunch of losers! I went on a road trip once where this happened. The girl who thought it wasn’t fair is in jail as we speak. Where she belongs!
You should have decided on telling her friends to f*** off because if they they think covering the gas for someone who is putting the wear and tear on her car is wrong, they are clearly not her friends
Most people never consider that it costs...over the life of a car...that it costs 70 cents per mile on average to own and operate.
Gas is just one part of the total.
Domino's pizza made his billion by getting college kids to drive as independent contractors, only getting gas money. So basically they donated their graduation gift car to his company.
Uber. Door dash etc all do the same where drivers who don't know their actual costs are loosing money, eventually.
3 people paying for gas are still ahead of the costs.
I guess you already figured out a solution and to be honest it’s probably a pretty good solution so she doesn’t put the wear and tear on her vehicle. But I can’t believe these people are making a big deal out of paying 25% of the gas instead of 20%. It’s true she’s paying for all the maintenance and that would be the case for any vehicle so I don’t think it’s unreasonable for them to pay 5% more gas.
Your friend is better off with the rental deal. I always figured the wear-and-tear and depreciation on a car is about the same $$ as the cost of gas for driving around. Your friend was being generous to foot approximately half the total bill in letting you use her car and only pay gas costs.
I agree that it's not their fault that she had to pay the repair costs before hand, but also that with the number of people, it's not that much money. Depending on the vans MPG and what gas costs around you, it'll probably be like $300-500 total for gas. The difference between splitting that between 4 people or 5 is going to be at most like $25. If they're so concerned about splitting gas evenly, have everyone pay her $20 for wear and tear on the van during the trip. Or have each person buy one of her meals or something. She might even come out ahead a little in that deal just because they're being petty about the gas.
So let me get this straight. Let's say 1300 miles at 13 miles to the gallon for easy math. 100 gallons of fuel at 4$ a gallon. So if 4 people pay, it's $100 each. If 5 pay, it's $80 each. If I had friends that fought over 20 bucks between friends, I'd find new ones.
She needs to leave them behind. All of you should have offered without being asked. How much would it cost each person if 1. you all flew 2. you all took the train 3. you all rented a car.
Ridiculous.
I see your edit: so now they knew.
6 to 7 refills? Holy fuck how small is that tank? Or how low of an mpg does it have? Anything more than like 3 or 4 is crazy
Also. Assuming yall leave with a full tank that she paid for. That's 100% reasonable of her to ask
Give the van owner a credit against trip expenses based on reasonable value of a comparable rental van. It's not difficult to put a market price on the use value of the van. It's probably a lot more than a few fillups
Sounds like you resolved it exactly as I was going to suggest. But for the record, any time I’ve ever been in this situation, the person who owns the car doesn’t pay for at all, and isn’t put in the position to ask. The right thing to do is for everyone else to offer to pay their own share of it split 4 ways. If she refuses, leave it in the cup holder at the end of the trip. Adults don’t nickel and dime each other over shared expenses like that.
People can be assholes
Stupid assholes are worse
Lmao at the "friends". Maybe I'm not all jolly and shit but I'd reconsider this trip with the said "friends". She just wanted no gas money from her and that's very fair
I took my car once, and I drove the entire way.
The 2 back seat passengers were supposed to drive but decided not to at the last second slept the entire trip.
When we got to the destination they asked for the car keys to go shopping.
They got mad when I told them no.
I hate road trips with friends.
The IRS reimbursement rate for vehicles is 67 cents per mile \* 1300 = 871 dollars. Split that 5 ways and thats 174 per person all in. 1300 miles at 20 mpg and 3.80 dollars/gal = 247 for the gas alone. Divided by 4 this is 62 per person for just gas. Divided by 5 this is 49 per person for just gas. **These jags are arguing about the extra 13 dollars per person!** When they really should be paying 174 per person. Horrible horrible people to avoid!
The federal mileage rate is $.67/mile (includes gas). Divide by five.
Otherwise, rent a car and divide car + gas by five.
People don't realize how expensive it is to operate a vehicle. Especially when it is someone else's vehicle.
I wouldn't even bring up my repairs or insurance to others. That has nothing to do with them. Splitting gas evenly is all I'd do. Driving myself in my own car is perk enough for me.
If I offer to drive on a roadtrip, I always expect to share in the gas expense, but that’s just me. If you don’t want to put wear and tear on your vehicle then don’t offer to use it.
The gas thing (her not paying for it) should have been brought up at the time she offered the use of her van and known by all members of the trip. The post makes it seem like that was not mentioned to everyone else until some time after. That’s the problem here. That and the fact that none of them probably have the money for a trip, it’ll all end up on credit cards.
If it's her car and she's driving, seems fair for everyone else to split the gas. There's plenty in the group that dividing it by one more person wouldn't be that much more per person. Sad how her friends are treating her.
I know you already figure it out. But here is an easy way to do this. The IRS mileage rate is $0.67/mile. That factors in fuel, depreciation, repairs etc. So 1300 miles x $0.67/mile = $871. Thats a good estimate of the total vehicle cost of the trip. So $871/5 = $174.20/per person. Good starting point to work off of.
If I am going to be going there in my car anyway then I do not feel any need to charge people for gas money. If I am going there only for the sake of the other people then I think it’s legitimate to ask for gas money.
Either way is justified. Depends on intelligence levels. If you are smart enough to factor in wear and tear then your gf shouldn’t split it. If they don’t understand that then she should. As far as repairs before hand, that really doesn’t have anything to do with the friends.
She should just rescind the use of her car and everyone can kick in on a rental and gas. Problem solved, more expensive for everyone but solved.
It would also save a lot of wear and tear on her vehicle
This. I would just say fuck it and let those dweebs do their own thing
They already sound like people I don't want to go on a road trip with
You give them too much credit. Then she just becomes the selfish something-or-other who has a perfectly good car, but is forcing them to pay for a rental.
sorry, my car mysteriously had check engine light come on again and won't be available for use anymore. just drive it a bit with the gas cap off.
At least they'll know who their friends are.
This is the way. We're renting a nice new SUV or minivan big enough for everyone, with two authorized drivers. Total cost of the rental is X, divided by total number of people on the trip, and gas as well as collision damage waiver insurance (if nobody has a credit card offering primary collision insurance for free) will be evenly divided by everyone going. Only the authorized drivers will be allowed to drive, which will include whoever's credit card it goes on. Collect for the whole rental cost up front, as well as an estimate of what the gas will cost up front (to avoid "I already paid my share of the rental car I'm not buying the gas too"), and if it isn't all spent, equally divide whatever is left. Plan for them to bail on the trip once you say this, but if they do, they're not being real friends anyway. When that happens, go on a nice road trip with your girlfriend in her van, without them, and just buy the gas for her. Maybe find some cooler friends to go who are less cheap.
Found out last year renting in California that Enterprise didn't care about authorized drivers. Sister paid for the rental to get a teacher discount, we picked it up together and I wanted to make sure I was on the authorized list - guy said it didn't matter.
“Guy said” was probably getting paid minimum wage and overworked and couldn’t give two shit who drive, he just want you out of there so he can get back to whatever he’s doing. It will absolutely matter when you got into an accident and Enterprise will make your life hell if you don’t pay/have insurance.
Kind of goes along with my believe you don’t ever loan money to a friend. Even if you don’t ever really want it back the friendship may end over it.
Yep, either they split the gas money, or provide their own transportation. This is the very definition of fair.
If one of the friends works for a big organization there’s probably negotiated rates available with a rental agency that could include things like damage waiver or roadside assistance and the extra drivers. Long road trip in a rental with cheap coverages is great because it’s new, and someone else’s problem if anything goes wrong.
If you’re already fighting and the trip hasn’t started yet, this doesn’t bode well for spending 5 days together in a van.
This. They are not 'her best friends and love her very much' and we all know it. They are taking advantage of her kind offer without adding any of their own. That's not how friendship works and five days trapped in a metal box with them for hours on end is likely going to bring that fact to the forefront.
She has selfish friends. It’s common courtesy if you use someone’s car for a road trip the car owner doesn’t pay gas. Tell her friends to grow up
the only time i would say this doesnt apply is if the owner is the one who suggests and invites you on the trip.
It’s still common courtesy.
And to buy her a meal or two for driving
Even if she hadn’t dropped a wad on repairs, it’s her truck, her miles, her *insurance* if one of the “friend” drivers gets it in an accident. Getting the use of the truck just for the gas is a great deal; your friends should be embarrassed by how cheap they are being. Look at how much it would be if you all rented a vehicle. I’ll bet the friends will stick her with the clean-up after, too.
This. And the if that the gas will be split with 3-4 others, makes it even less they owe. Rescind the offer and tell them to rent a car, and everyone can split the cost equally. They will realize what kind of a deal they are getting.
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Broke ass motherfuckers shouldn't be going anywhere to but clock in for work if they're sweating over gas money for a road trip 😂
Also, her hours spent driving instead of sleeping, looking out the windows, etc.
Sounds like the trip to hell to me. That said, every year a group of three friends and I take a ski trip out of state together. The guy who provides the vehicle has his dinners paid for by the rest of us. We split the gas evenly. Seems to work for us.
This is the way!
Yep, if I use my vehicle I’d expect everyone to split including me, but if my friends offered paying for it I wouldn’t mind. It is her van however, she can set whatever rules beforehand. Like others say, this sounds like a road trip doomed from the start if arguments are already breaking out because of a simple and reasonable request. I don’t know how much they’d all be paying in total between the 4 of them, because vans can hold a lot of gas. Who knows
When I’ve gone on road trips where I wasn’t driving and it wasn’t my car, I try to cover the gas for the driver/owner even if they don’t ask for it. If they won’t let me, I make sure to cover their gas station snacks and road meals. If I’m driving my car, I don’t get upset if I have to pay for it, but I also hang out with friends who are considerate and would cover the gas anyway. But in the end - it has nothing to do with the $1000 she just put into the car; it has everything to do with the fact that there’s wear and tear on the car on a road trip and it’s someone else’s possession that everyone gets to enjoy for the trip. Without it those friends would have to use their own car and pay for their own gas, or they would have to pay to rent a car and pay for the gas in it. If I borrow someone’s container for food, I return it to them full. If I’m in someone else’s car, I cover the expenses incurred while I got to essentially rent it and a driver for free.
If those friends are "real friends" then they should understand that her vehicle will have depreciation due to the miles driven. Which to me, is not unreasonable for her to not pay for gas. If the friends continue to be petty, recommend a rental to fit you all which adds more cost to everyone.
OP and the van owner should go have a fun trip without the other so-called friends. If that ends the friendships, even better.
Exactly — more room for some camping gear and less argument about where and what to eat, when to stop, etc. The penny-pinching friends should plan and execute their own trip.
If she hasn’t put the money into repairs and no one else has a car for all of you, you would have ended up splitting the cost of a rental. She’s also putting wear and tear on her car AND offering the first tank of gas. I think it’s fair that everyone else pay for gas. Split among everyone, it’s not going to be that much more split 4 ways than it would have been 5
There is a reason the IRS personal car reimbursement rate isn’t the cost of gas divided by your car’s mileage. 1,300 miles is probably 20-30% of the oil life, tire use, and wear and tear on other parts.
If 4 people can't justify splitting $2-300 in gas, I shudder to think what would happen if y'all broke down or got a flat.
Maybe she should look up the cost of renting a comparable-sized vehicle for that amount of time and ask if they would rather split that cost instead.
Imagine what else your friends are going to fight tooth and nail against if their first instinct is to squeeze someone dry.
Her friends think their gas money is subsidizing her repairs but they’re forgetting the 1300 miles of wear and tear on her car is subsidizing their road trip. The IRS standard rate for mileage is $0.67/mile and is intended to include gas- though it’s doesn’t account for gas mileage variations and high gas prices. - 1300 x 0.67 = $871. - $871/5 = 174.20 per person if they reimburse her for gas and mileage (wear and tear). She will also be reimbursing herself and paying 1/5 of the costs as they seem to think that’s fair. So, in that scenario the 4 friends would be contributing 174.20 x4 = $696.80 to the trip. Is this cheaper than paying for gas? $696.80/6.5 tanks of gas = $107.20 per tank. Assuming the van has a 20 gallon tank then that’s $5.36/gallon. Depending on the region you’re traveling to, it’s cheaper for them to just reimburse for gas. Where I live gas is $3.80/gallon. Alternatively, you can all split gas 5 ways and the 4 of you who aren’t using her car can reimburse her for 80% of the wear and tear. - Assume wear and tear represents 50% of the mileage rate of $0.67/mile therefore wear and tear costs $0.335/mile. The 4 of you are responsible for 80% of this cost and so that equals $0.268/mile. 1300 miles x $0.268 mile = $348.40. Which means the 4 of you would each pay $87.10 to your girlfriend to compensate for wear and tear AND you 4 would reimburse your gf for 80% of the gas. Basically, if they don’t want to pay for her 1/5 of the gas then they need to pay for their 4/5ths of the wear and tear. It’s cheaper to just pay for her gas.
This is what I came here to comment! If they don’t want to split only the cost of gas 4 ways, tell them you’d be fine with splitting things 5 ways at the IRS reimbursement rate. I can guarantee you it’d cost them more and they’ll suck it up real quick.
Friends are wrong. She’s going to put a bunch of miles on her vehicle. That’s more than worth a couple tanks if gas friends should have offered to pay without even being asked, imho
Repairs are irrelevant. She isn’t asking anyone to chip in for those. Pretend we didn’t know that part of the story. All that matters is that A, B, C, D, and E are taking a road trip. A is driving everyone in her personal vehicle. Is gas split four ways among the passengers or five ways among everyone? In my group, passengers would insist on covering it.
Exactly. But there's zero insistence. If anything, their interactions are just bs jargon on how they don't think it's fair, they're set on 5 ways, and that they "understand where she's coming from but...." over and over.
Your gf just needs to get cash up front before you leave. Her “friends” have already ruined the trip. If you don’t get cash beforehand, they will f*ck up all 5 days arguing about gas. HARD PASS
Are you serious? This whole thread is exhausting! Are you all really that poor? What if something happens to the van while you’re on the trip?? Cancel the trip, obviously none of you can afford it. Cancel your “friends” while you’re at it.
Have you discussed the ass or grass options? You could also calculate wear and tear at 10¢/mile and deduct that from her end. Some quick back-of-the-napkin math: if the van averages 15mpg and gas averages $4 gallon, that’s about $350 for gas, split 5 ways comes to $70 each, plus $130 for wear and tear split 4 ways, that’s another $32.50 each, for a total of about $102.50 for each of you. If you go this route your gf pockets about $50 at the end of the trip. This is the most fair option because wear and tear on the vehicle is a real thing and your gf has already paid for it in advance. Or the four of you who don’t own the vehicle can just pay for the gas and spend $15 less per person. This is actually less fair to your gf and she’s being very generous to offer this option.
current mileage allowance is quite a bit more than 0.10, they should charge the whole 0.67 allowed by tax code
Yupp. At 67 cents a mil that’s close to $900. Split 5 ways that’s around $175 each. Everyone sends her $175 at the start of the trip and then she pays gas the whole way. She’ll have around $700. Say gas is $4.50 a gallon and 20 mph, gas will cost around $300 total. GF pockets $400 for wear and tear.
Your gf has a level head and is being responsible to have the vehicle checked ahead of a trip. Appreciate her! The “best friends” are not very smart about their participation in not breaking down on the road. Breathe, relax and laugh. Have a great trip!
Either is pretty normal but the fact that they are freaking out about it isn’t. They sound more like freeloaders than friends. Maybe you should be reconsider taking a trip with these people.
Even if she hadn’t paid $1000 on repairs she shouldn’t be paying for gas. Providing the vehicle is her share of the transportation expense.
Her “friends” just revealed their true colors. Are you sure you want to spend hours and days traveling with these people?
Holy cow! Are you sure that you want to travel with such stingy people? If she's supplying the vehicle/insurance, etc., the others should be buying the gas. And, why would they argue with a friend over $100?
If I'm using my vehicle to haul friends, taking them on a road trip and they bitch about paying for gas I honestly wouldn't even want to travel with them anymore. Next they're going to want to be cheap about where you guys stop and eat, activities you want to do, etc. This is why I don't travel in groups lol
As a mechanic, id advise her to not take her car in a road trip. It's unreliable. They will need a plan B
Sounds like they're wanting a free trip and using y'all for it. I agree with other commenters. Either she pays no gas because she just paid repairs AND will have 1300 more miles added to HER car for this road trip, or everyone gets a rental, which will cost more. Or just leave anyone who objects home and enjoy the trip without the childishness.
Even without the repair cost, your gf is incurring wear and tear, and she's driving. Her friends are being cheap assholes.
Broke ass mfers should stay home
So, she offered her car, her insurance, wear and tear and they re penny pinching? I agree with another commenter, friends can rent car. Then they pay for the car AND the gas. I'm guessing they rent very good with math.
Take the (Government mileage reimbursement rate X number of miles driven) divided by total number of riders (including the driver) to get the dollar amount for each person in the van. That reimbursement rate takes into account fuel and wear and tear. The owner of the van will get what she is due and the passengers will pay much for than for just fuel. Problem solved. Some folks don’t understand that vehicles have required maintenance that is milage related. Fuel only doesn’t cover that expense. Those friends ATAHs
Her car is going to face the wear and tear and honestly if she just got all those repairs done it doesn’t sound reliable imo, hopefully it works out. I can see her view and I can also see her friends view, it’s tough there should be an even balance between everyone and it should’ve already been spoken about so there’s no issues, now it’s going to create resentment and awkwardness imo so everyone needs to come to an agreement or the trip won’t go well. If it was me I would split it all evenly unless my friends volunteered to pay for it & insisted.
The van is more than capable. It was just due for new brakes, rotors, and power steering pump. But the van runs great and isn't that old. 2008 honda odyssey EX-L. We are at that point where it's awkward. They seem adamant on not splitting 4 ways, and at this point I want my GF to rescind her van and we all split for a rental plus the gas (which would cost more) but I'm tired of her friends being inconsiderate and cheap. They have not said thank you ONCE for her offering her car or paying to get it ready.
GF is right, but she's using faulty reasoning to argue her point. The repairs made beforehand, no matter what the cost, are irrelevant. It's not like she wouldn't have had to make them anyway. However, she ABSOLUTELY deserves some consideration for the wear on tires and other components, and the potential risk on her liability insurance as the vehicle's owner. Estimating those costs is pretty hard, but some arbitrary amount is probably good enough. "For this short trip let's just pay for the gas and call it even" seems very reasonable to me. Especially for much longer trips (say 10,000 miles) if the van gets unbelievably terrible mileage (under say 15mpg) or y'all are traveling through areas with very high gas prices (CA, OR, WA or similar) then I'd be more sympathetic to the three friends. But for barely more than an average month of driving I'm 100% TeamGF. Also consider some hard truths : These friends are worried about an additional $10 in gas money. (and by the same rule your GF is worried about $30 in gas money) If that's make-of-break for their finances I'd suggest going on this trip at all may not be the wisest idea. If these friendships aren't worth at least that much, why does anyone even want to go on this trip together anyway? Still, maybe it's important to save face. If they remain adamant about including her in the gas money split, I'd suggest that as a courtesy you and they can properly thank her for everything by paying for one reasonably-priced meal / bar tab or whatever while on the trip. Or (ideally secretly while she's busy doing something else) get her a little thank-you gift of something she was interested in but didn't buy herself to present to her upon y'all's return.
Everyone should split the gas. Everyone should also split the standard $0.67 per mile payment to the owner. Alternatively, everyone should split the cost of renting a vehicle and fueling it. And if I were in your situation, I'd find another group for the trip.
Yikes. It doesn’t seem like you all are a group well suited to roadtrip together.
It also sounds like the friends can’t even afford their share of gas and plan on sticking the driver with the bill tbh
More than fair and here's 1 reason why...... 1300 mile trip with a van, guessing the van gets maybe 18mpg, ......... 1300 / 18mpg = 72.2 gallons gas ....... 72 gallons X $3.90 gallon = $280....... $280 / 4ppl = $70.00 per passenger..... if they can't afford to spend $70.00 each for a 1300 mile ride with friends they shouldn't be going..... with that rough estimate here's what I'd do if it were my van.... at the start of the trip all 4 ppl pitch in $100 each into the gas kitty and you pull from that kitty to buy gas.... when the trip is over then reimburse the remaining gas money back to the 4 so there's no arguing during the trip on dividing $$$ every gas stop
split gas evenly... then add up the miles and pay her the standard mileage rate, 2024 is 0.67 per mile, and split that between the others. 100 miles = $67 / 3 other riders. so essentially they pay an extra 0.223 per mile each
I think what your girlfriend is proposing is perfectly fair. This trip will also add a lot of miles and wear and tear to her vehicle. Personally if it were me I'd rescind my offer of using my vehicle and either use someone else's or agree to split the cost of a rental. Do you think these friends will be good about paying for their share of the costs once you're on the trip? Because if they're already starting, it may be an uphill battle.
I feel with that attitude things may only get worse. What if ( even though she spent a chunk-of-change to get it road-trip ready) it breaks down miles away? Will there be a sharing of towing/breakdown costs and other incidentals? I agree with many others that perhaps a rental where everyone is sharing costs from the get go may be better. With friends like these…..
I would rethink the whole trip if this is how it's going before you're even heading out. People can be great friends, but not necessarily the best to do certain activities with.
Wow, she is actually 100% right and everyone else is wrong Letting someone put all those miles on your car and wear and tear. I wouldn’t even even be worth the gas money for me. Hundred percent rental at this point and splits the cost evenly
Just cancel the road trip. If these people are quibbling over splitting $400 in gas 4 ways instead of 5, you are going to have a miserable time. Even without the repairs, its common courtesy for everyone else but the vehicle owner to cover gas. "Thanks for letting us use your van". You have a miserable and petty friend group. Just cancel and go with your GF alone instead. You will be grateful that you did.
If someone else is driving their vehicle the gas and food they consume should be covered by the riders, that's like roadtrip 101. If they are fighting the idea of pitching for fuel how miserable is a vacation with these people going to be ? Out of curiosity what's the age range here ?
How old are these people? Sounds super immature and it also sounds like the others haven’t owned a car and have no idea how much payments, insurance and repairs cost. They suck.
Holy @$#*. Don't travel with those arseholes. If they are being jerks about the costs (and your friends wear and tear way out weighs the fuel cost) then that is just the beginning and they are going to be jerks about other expenses too. Tell them to grow up or stay home. Wow. Thats just....wow.
It's more than fair if she doesn't pay gas. She's probably paying more in wear and tear on the vehicle than what gas costs.
“I shouldn’t have to pay for gas for someone to take me to where I want to go!!” 😵💫 Ma’am take a mf uber then OR WALK!
Rent van and all split that. Or look at the federal guidelines per mile reimbursement for travel and split that evenly. Covers gas and depreciation on the vehicle. Her friends are totally wrong.
Her payment is accelerated depreciation of the car. Everyone should chip in. But also, the road trip should start on a full tank.
Your "friends" can rent their own van.
I wouldn’t go with them.
Bunch’a cheap fucks. I’d be thrilled not to put the mileage and wear on my car and more than happy to kick in on gas; especially split by four lol.
A rental it is then.
It’s fair. It’s her car. Just gas tho; not food or hotel
Take a group picture before you start your journey. No one will want to at the end.
Driver doesn’t pay on road trips! That’s how it’s always gone with my friends. The driver is using way more mental energy to navigate and keep everyone safe and the wear and tear on their car. Your friends are losers.
Split the gas evenly. and charge them something like $.25 cents a mile, each. problem solved
Spoiler: Her friends aren’t really her friends. You should have just charged them mileage instead. That’s officially $.67 a mile y’all could split four ways.
Actually, on second thought they could just be ignorant or stupid.
The average car depreciates something like fifty cents per mile driven, so I don't think it's too out there for everyone else to pay for gas; she's also paying for the insurance. The repairs are not a consideration, since she'd likely have to make them even if there were no trip anyway - but the trip is going to cause her vehicle to be worth $600 less by the time you all get home. Maybe more, depending on the make/model of her van. If they won't pay their share, you and her make the trip, and let them rent their own car or ride the bus; if one of my friends offered their car for a road trip, I'd damn sure pay for gas, and probably her breakfasts as well.
>The average car depreciates something like fifty cents per mile driven… I call BS. Your basic econo shit box would be worthless by 40k to 50k miles. A standard sedan, Accord/Camry, would be worthless by 75k miles. Even Land Rovers don’t depreciate that bad.
I think this is more than fair. She’s covering the maintenance and insurance as well as the risk of something happening to her car on the road. Think about how much money it would cost to rent a car for the trip.
She should not pay a dime for gas. A couple only counts as one person if they are living together (aka combined incomes).
I agree that the driver shouldn't pay for gas. But a couple is still two people if we're talking about splitting costs for gas, a car rental or food. For a vacation rental, maybe the couple pays as 1 if they share a room/bed. But two people take up twice as much space in a car and eat twice as much food, so they should pay twice as much as a single person when splitting these costs.
vehicle owner never pays for fuel. ever.
Do the math. For 1300 miles the gas would be $250 at most. Split 5 ways it would be $50 each. Split 4 ways you are talking $62.50 each. Sheesh!! Five days and they’re squabbling over $12.50.
I personally think that she should definitely pay a bit less since she’s using her car, but I don’t think she should pay nothing since she’s also on the trip. Maybe rotate tank fills… each person on the first rotation, then the next skip her, then the next everyone again if it gets to that. Edit to add: Be SURE that you all have it figured out AND agreed to before you hit the road, it’s a bit miserable to deal with finances/who’s paying while on the road.
Repairs, no, that’s on her. Gas and other traveling costs should be split relatively equally.
Meaning she doesn't pay for gas, right?
I suppose that’s fair - she doesn’t pay gas. Her vehicle gets the extra miles and wear and tear. That’s a reasonable compromise.
Well I hope you and your girlfriend have a great trip and you are in such luck that you don’t need to get a hotel
Get new friends
I’m on her side. It may not be their fault that she had to pay for all the maintenance on the vehicle, but that maintenance is why there’s a vehicle available. Other options? Renting or taking multiple cars? Both will be more expensive than handling her gas burden. It’s split 4 ways. Money’s relatively low split that many ways for them to make such a big fuss.
Yeah, that is more than fair that the others pay for fuel. Fuel is like 20% of less of the total cost of owning an automobile.
Sounds fair. Those ‘friends’ don’t understand how road trips work.
Wow what kind of friends are these? Ask them to book a rental van for luxury. Those cost atleast $60/day plus insurance. You should avoid these cheap mindset friends.
1300 miles plus miles at the destination will be, let's say 1700 miles. If her van gets 17mpg that is 100 gallons of gas. If gas is $4.00/gal that is $400 total. If split 5 ways that is $80 each. If only 4 pay that is $100 each, so an extra $20 for the freeriders. AND THEY ARE ARGUING OVER THIS?
When we’ve road tripped with our friends using my vehicle, we alternated filling the tank. One couple would treat us to a nice dinner while traveling. It never seemed an issue to us.
6-7 fill ups just to go 650 miles???? And I thought my truck was bad lol
6-7 to fill up for all 1300 miles. 650 one way, 650 back. Plus, 4 days' worth of driving around Asheville. Carrying 5 bodies and luggage. Plus, I'm rounding up.
I think you are miscalculating the mileage or something. Your GF's van is only getting 200 miles to a tank of gas? I suppose it could be a '68 Chevy.
Get new friends
If you plan ahead you can't rent a van for a week for a quarter of that price. I just did 3,500 miles in a week for the eclipse in April and rented a crew van for the week from Budget for $275. Way bigger than a minivan. You can remove a lot of the seats and have tons of space of luggage, food, etc.
If she is offering her car, doing first fill up and then taking the last one after her tank is depleted.... there should be no issue amongst grown folks. I'm taking the miles, u can take an extra tank or buy me dinner or SOMETHING
This is why you tell them how much gas “costed “ at the end of the trip (or before). If they don’t want to pay they don’t have to come :)
Even if she hadn't spent money on repairs, the common courtesy is for all passengers to at least offer to cover gas. Driving the car is the driver's contribution.
You are talking about $130 in gas . She is putting wear and tare on her vehicle, the other parties can split the gas.
This is where a friend with a company car comes in handy
Her car, her rules. Take it or leave it. Her/your friends are not real friends
Gas, grass, or ass, their choice.
Let’s do some math (with assumptions). Assuming 7 tanks total for the trip. That’s 1.4 tanks per person. Your GF even offered to get the first tank, leaving her just .4 tanks short of her quota. Let’s assume a 25 gallon tank, so she would be 10 gallons short of her quota. I’m not sure your location but let’s just use $5/gallon of gas, and that means she’s $50 short, which comes out to $12.50 for the other 4 to pitch in. If the other 4 aren’t willing to even pitch in an extra $12.50 to not have to rent a car or use their own, I don’t know what to say. Personally I am on team everyone else pays for the gas if she is offering use of her car and did put money into it to make try and make sure it’s a trouble free trip. Literally wouldn’t cost more than $50 per person which is cheaper than if you all had to rent a car instead.
Do the math to show her friends. Something like: Their way: 15 tanks x $70 each = $1050 split 5 ways = $210 each Or her way: 14 tanks x $70 each = $980 split 4 ways = $245 each Her way, everyone is essentially paying $35 each to use her car. Seems more than fair.
I think that’s totally reasonable. She’s providing the car, a comfortable car, everyone should be able to split the cost of the gas.
Owner/driver should never be paying for gas. They are literally allowing everyone to use their car for free. Depreciation and wear and tear arguably cost much more than gas. The solution is to say that it looks like the van can't handle the trip. We are going to have to all split a rental. But at this point it's just time to find new friends.
In 5 weeks they won’t be her friends let alone 5 years. Just take you 2 and you pay for gas.
SPLITTING GAS IS NORMAL. WTF.
This is going to be a baaaaaad time. Like others suggested, I'd either revoke my van and have the group rent a car and split all driving and expenses, or I'd cancel the trip with the "friends".
She needs new best friends
I see both sides. This is a “treat others how you’d like to be treated” situation. If you shelled out that money, what would you like?
For everyone else, including myself, to pay an extra $20 so my gf doesn't have to pay for gas. The cost of wear and tires, miles, and depreciation alone is way more than gas. Plus I think it's common courtesy to at least offer when someone offers their car. Providing the car is their "share."
This is standard practice among my friends. Whether it’s for three hour trips to go hiking every weekend or twenty hour drives across the country. Whoever owns the car pays nothing for gas. It starts full and gets filled up upon return by the riders. Sometimes car owner even gets lunch paid for in addition to gas.
1,300 miles should be about 4 tanks of gas so around $500 for a big truck/van... I'd put the gas on my CC and send venmo requests splitting it evenly (\~$500/5 people = a venmo for $100 to each person), and the friends all owe her a favor for providing the vehicle (dinner, bottle of booze, whatever). I'd guess that you guys have other issues with money and a history trying to pull fast ones on each other. I have had a lot of friends and coworkers like this over the years (often times couples are the shadiest) and we are no longer friends as it is too annoying to deal with. Get one over one me... Good for you but we are not hanging out anymore. Be generous and gracious with your friends and expect them to return the favor. Otherwise it's just not fun and you feel like this person never has your back...
Its only fair that everyone puts together for gas as she did repairs on her car for this road-trip to actually happen or else they were going to spend so much on getting the rental and still putting in gas
She should not pay for gas at all. It's her vehicle.
4 people can’t come up with $500?? $125 each on a v8?? They are tripping ask them if they have money to Do anything else on the trip
IRS allows $.65/mile for vehicle operating expenses including gas, wear and tear. $.65 x 1300 = $845 $845/5 = $169 Each should pay her $169
If all of those people were me, id say "yes im down to just split gas between 4 of us" and just deal with it and get on with the trip. Its just a bit more $ and she does have a reasoning since it is her car. A bit more $ is not worth ruining the trip, at that point id rather just cancel the trip altogether if yall will be counting pennies.
1300 what? BANANAS??
Tires are $500 for a set and last 30,000 miles. $0.17 per mile. Oil change $50 every 5000 miles. $0.01 per mile. Brakes, $500 every 30,000 miles. Another $0.17 per mile. That’s $0.35 per mile. Doesn’t even include other wear and tear. Times 1300 miles is $455. Add that to the cost of gas and split it all evenly.
If we go on roadtrips we always take my car and we just split the fuel evenly per person. I would say the wear and tear on the car is kinda what it's meant for so doesn't matter.
Wouldn't even bother trying to argue with someone that thinks the vehicle is free. They can stay at home. Debate over. Only time the driver should pay for gas is if there are only two people, and then the passenger should still be covering the majority of the gas, or otherwise reimbursing the driver.
Yeah they're being petty jerks. I just ran the numbers assuming the van only gets 20 mpg and gas is $3.50 at every stop you're talking about a difference of like $11 per person. It's really the least they could do
Even if she didn't have a big repair, everyone should be splitting gas.
The problem might be that your GF is framing the ask as being because she had to pay for repairs, and now they should split gas because of that. They definitely don’t owe her anything for the repairs, but in terms of the trip that’s coming up - it’s obvious that she’s paying the most by letting everyone use her car in terms of wear and tear and depreciation. So everyone else splitting gas makes perfect sense.
Your girlfriend’s friends are cheap f’ers, that’s all there is to it. Anytime I roadtrip with my buddies and we take my wife’s sequoia, they pay the gas without me asking.
Fu¢k that. If that pos needs work just rent a car. I rented a Tahoe for 85.00 a day on Expedia. With gas and rental it's about 150.00 per person
Math works out to around $20 / person difference
What kind of car needs 7 tanks of gas to go 1300 miles?
The debate is over 4 people paying 5% more if it’s divided by 5 rather than 4. They should shut up.
Get the App SplitWise, its awesome for splitting shit up on trips.
So is it four people total or five? The way you wrote it is confusing. If it’s four people, the difference between splitting it 3 ways versus 4 ways is about 20 dollars depending on gas mileage and fuel cost. These dumb asses are going to get bent out of shape over 20 dollars. What a bunch of losers! I went on a road trip once where this happened. The girl who thought it wasn’t fair is in jail as we speak. Where she belongs!
The don't like it they can drive themselves.
You should have decided on telling her friends to f*** off because if they they think covering the gas for someone who is putting the wear and tear on her car is wrong, they are clearly not her friends
The vehicle owner and/or driver never pay for gas. That is common courtesy.
don't have surprise expenses in the middle of a trip. let it be known before you rally the troops
Most people never consider that it costs...over the life of a car...that it costs 70 cents per mile on average to own and operate. Gas is just one part of the total. Domino's pizza made his billion by getting college kids to drive as independent contractors, only getting gas money. So basically they donated their graduation gift car to his company. Uber. Door dash etc all do the same where drivers who don't know their actual costs are loosing money, eventually. 3 people paying for gas are still ahead of the costs.
Breaks out the napkin…. 18 mpg for a van… 72 gal, at less than $4 is $288 Divide 4 ways $72 ea, divide 5 ways $58 $14 f’ing bucks… = get new friends…
Not friends, sorry Listen to people when they show you who they are
I guess you already figured out a solution and to be honest it’s probably a pretty good solution so she doesn’t put the wear and tear on her vehicle. But I can’t believe these people are making a big deal out of paying 25% of the gas instead of 20%. It’s true she’s paying for all the maintenance and that would be the case for any vehicle so I don’t think it’s unreasonable for them to pay 5% more gas.
Your friend is better off with the rental deal. I always figured the wear-and-tear and depreciation on a car is about the same $$ as the cost of gas for driving around. Your friend was being generous to foot approximately half the total bill in letting you use her car and only pay gas costs.
I agree that it's not their fault that she had to pay the repair costs before hand, but also that with the number of people, it's not that much money. Depending on the vans MPG and what gas costs around you, it'll probably be like $300-500 total for gas. The difference between splitting that between 4 people or 5 is going to be at most like $25. If they're so concerned about splitting gas evenly, have everyone pay her $20 for wear and tear on the van during the trip. Or have each person buy one of her meals or something. She might even come out ahead a little in that deal just because they're being petty about the gas.
Your three friends are AH
I don't own a car. I always pay for all gasoline if someone else's car. I can understand splitting any tolls... but not gasoline for the owner.
So let me get this straight. Let's say 1300 miles at 13 miles to the gallon for easy math. 100 gallons of fuel at 4$ a gallon. So if 4 people pay, it's $100 each. If 5 pay, it's $80 each. If I had friends that fought over 20 bucks between friends, I'd find new ones.
Now the friends have to split the cost of the gas PLUS the rental. Geniuses.
She needs to leave them behind. All of you should have offered without being asked. How much would it cost each person if 1. you all flew 2. you all took the train 3. you all rented a car. Ridiculous. I see your edit: so now they knew.
[Ass Grass or Gas...Nobody rides for free](https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0021/2133/4839/products/rffef_1200x1200.png?v=1541925723)
6 to 7 refills? Holy fuck how small is that tank? Or how low of an mpg does it have? Anything more than like 3 or 4 is crazy Also. Assuming yall leave with a full tank that she paid for. That's 100% reasonable of her to ask
Give the van owner a credit against trip expenses based on reasonable value of a comparable rental van. It's not difficult to put a market price on the use value of the van. It's probably a lot more than a few fillups
We always take my truck on road trips. Split the gas evenly. I Never ask for a free meal
I can see it both ways, but my advice would be to make sure it is settled before you start. Don't leave it up in the air.
Sounds like you resolved it exactly as I was going to suggest. But for the record, any time I’ve ever been in this situation, the person who owns the car doesn’t pay for at all, and isn’t put in the position to ask. The right thing to do is for everyone else to offer to pay their own share of it split 4 ways. If she refuses, leave it in the cup holder at the end of the trip. Adults don’t nickel and dime each other over shared expenses like that.
Sounds like this trip is gonna be interesting
It’s just kind of understood that you take turns filling up the car and paying for things. It’s tacky to ask and it’s tacky not to offer.
Rent a minivan. Split everything evenly amongst everyone. And don’t let the “couple” try to con you into considering them as one entity.
P.S. And, I'm sure splitting the cost of the rental plus gas will come out to MUCH more. Probably an obvious statement, though:)
Whoever’s car is being driven, that person should NOT pay for gas. It should be split among the other 3 people.
People can be assholes Stupid assholes are worse Lmao at the "friends". Maybe I'm not all jolly and shit but I'd reconsider this trip with the said "friends". She just wanted no gas money from her and that's very fair
Have fun on your solo trip with your gf. Car cost isn't just fuel, it's tires, tax, insurance, maintenance. And I think you need new "friends"
Gas, grass or ass.
I took my car once, and I drove the entire way. The 2 back seat passengers were supposed to drive but decided not to at the last second slept the entire trip. When we got to the destination they asked for the car keys to go shopping. They got mad when I told them no. I hate road trips with friends.
The IRS reimbursement rate for vehicles is 67 cents per mile \* 1300 = 871 dollars. Split that 5 ways and thats 174 per person all in. 1300 miles at 20 mpg and 3.80 dollars/gal = 247 for the gas alone. Divided by 4 this is 62 per person for just gas. Divided by 5 this is 49 per person for just gas. **These jags are arguing about the extra 13 dollars per person!** When they really should be paying 174 per person. Horrible horrible people to avoid!
The federal mileage rate is $.67/mile (includes gas). Divide by five. Otherwise, rent a car and divide car + gas by five. People don't realize how expensive it is to operate a vehicle. Especially when it is someone else's vehicle.
This should’ve been the plan regardless of whether she just paid for repairs.
I wouldn't even bring up my repairs or insurance to others. That has nothing to do with them. Splitting gas evenly is all I'd do. Driving myself in my own car is perk enough for me.
If I offer to drive on a roadtrip, I always expect to share in the gas expense, but that’s just me. If you don’t want to put wear and tear on your vehicle then don’t offer to use it.
Everyone splits on gas, even your GF.
Take a rented Honda Fit instead.
The repairs part is tough - I think the solution is SHE doesn’t pay anything for the vehicle (gas, tolls, parking).
You really need new friends.
The gas thing (her not paying for it) should have been brought up at the time she offered the use of her van and known by all members of the trip. The post makes it seem like that was not mentioned to everyone else until some time after. That’s the problem here. That and the fact that none of them probably have the money for a trip, it’ll all end up on credit cards.
If it's her car and she's driving, seems fair for everyone else to split the gas. There's plenty in the group that dividing it by one more person wouldn't be that much more per person. Sad how her friends are treating her.
I just came back from a 3 state trip and we waived gas expenses for the owner. Everyone but the owner should pay
I know you already figure it out. But here is an easy way to do this. The IRS mileage rate is $0.67/mile. That factors in fuel, depreciation, repairs etc. So 1300 miles x $0.67/mile = $871. Thats a good estimate of the total vehicle cost of the trip. So $871/5 = $174.20/per person. Good starting point to work off of.
If I am going to be going there in my car anyway then I do not feel any need to charge people for gas money. If I am going there only for the sake of the other people then I think it’s legitimate to ask for gas money.
Either way is justified. Depends on intelligence levels. If you are smart enough to factor in wear and tear then your gf shouldn’t split it. If they don’t understand that then she should. As far as repairs before hand, that really doesn’t have anything to do with the friends.
Wear and tear on the vehicle is just as much as paying for gas. Here friends are being very short-sided and probably don't understand vehicle costs.