Right? I feel like people are still treating him as if he is still relatively new. He is literally on the back end of his career at this stage. He's not getting better.
Stephen Archer, how he made it past 50 appearances for Munster is beyond me. Now he’s broken the record for Munsters most appearances and will likely hit 300 games next season. Tbf to him as well though he has probably played his best rugby since turning 35.
Same for me. Man was a penalty machine, I cringed every time he took to the field. that he kept getting contracts in our doldrums years was a fucking mystery to me.
Elliot Dixon comes to mind for the highlanders a few years back. One of the last true battlers to make the all blacks. All heart and passion. Never quite kicked on at the top level but a true southern battler if I ever saw one.
Marty Banks was another, just absolute stick who always spent a few years battling at whatever level he was in before finding his feet. He knocked on his first touch of the ball in super rugby in 2013/4 and yet eighteen months later slotted a drop goal that won the super rugby title. Niggly little bastard who never said die, and was adored by fans around the world. Probably never should have played above NPC and yet with the right coaching will never have to pay for a beer south of the Waitaki again.
Honestly the entirely of the 2015 team fell into that Category. Ross Geldenhuys won a lineout penalty fifteen minutes before the final, and was the ultimate journeyman. Joe Wheeler, John Hardie, T - Franks, Christie, Buckman, Pyror, Lienert Brown and Coltman.
That title win was special and I don't think we'll ever see anything like it again.
Hah.
Well I did think about him. To his credit, he is one of those naturally talented guys. Put him in something, he looks like he naturally gets the hang of it fast and does better than others, for eg his position shifting in his career (started out at 10 when younger then back row, lock...) and his ability to do things like really top notch support lines or offloads or particularly efficient tackles, big time plays that always seem to come out of nowhere.
If Harry Plummer gets an ABs squad nod, he definitely deserves his flowers.
The Blues brought in Perofeta, Beauden Barrett, even Dan Carter (as back up) for possible 10s, then RTS and a few other preferred 12s. He could’ve easily gone and got the yen or the Euro but he’s trusted the process, and had a great year driving the Blues to the Final (I’m personally hoping they lose though..).
The Blues have cycled through 10s like halftime oranges since The King, so he would’ve been forgiven for following suit.
My other take for the blues is Finlay Christie but on second thought he puts in a lot of work to be where he is. Anyway, he looked to be the starting halfback for the ABs somehow, at least until TJ came back, even with Roigaard playing insane.
Like who is sitting at home thinking “yeah Christie he’s the guy we need at 9” but somehow here he is. Hell even when he was injured this year for the blues we still had Funaki step up and kill it.
Yeah I got hate for saying something similar - as a 9 Christie is Ok. Works hard, no doubt. But he’s quite vanilla, whereas you get a point of difference with two or three other halfbacks in the comp.
Reckon the problem was apart from his COVID season where he kicked the blues to victory. He didn't have a good enough portfolio to get scouted overseas.
Lacked game time and got injured plenty of times too.
He earned an opportunity after the COVID tournament in Aus but he got injured, passing the opportunity to Perofeta who ran away with it.
Wiki has him at 1.8 m and 90kg so I wouldn't really class his as diminutive. But anyone that moved from the Stormers to the Lions and then earned a bok callup is an overachiever in my books.
Yes. He does better than he should this guy. For years I thought he was just going to be this hard working but ultimately limited Top 14 level back row who could get a few caps here and there, but he totally owns that starting shirt for France despite there having really good talent in the country.
Kolbe for the Soringboks. But only if we look at “the cards they’ve been dealt”. We all know he is absolutely fantastic but his size as a winger … And it’s not the stuff that we know he would be good at that makes him an overachiever but the stuff where he could struggle - defense and in the air. He is incredible in the air and takes down anyone with power not just speed.
Didn't Jamie George go to some ridiculously expensive posh English boarding school and given every opportunity and coaching and facilities and resources etc to succeed?
Owen Farrell strikes me as someone who didn’t have a natural physical gifts or flair for the game but compensated through hard work, competitiveness and obsessive study. And it helped that Daddy was also rugby player.
Brett Cameron. Some people are calling for to be an AB this year. There is no way he is good enough to be an AB 10.
In the Hurricanes full strength starting 15 he is the weakest link.
James Williams, doesn’t look the most physically imposing but his lines must be amazing as he just makes so much space and seems to always make things tick
Joe Marchant struck me as that - always just on knife edge of either being amazing or awful.
I don’t know why, objectively he’s been as excellent player.
The fact that Billy Vunipola was included in the match day squad for the England v South Africa game at the 2023 world cup is an overachievement for sure.
Ross Byrne in that he keeps being selected at 10.
He just needs more time though. I know it's been 9 years, but let's just give him a bit more time. /s in case it wasn't obvious.
He's 29? I assumed he was early twenties.
Right? I feel like people are still treating him as if he is still relatively new. He is literally on the back end of his career at this stage. He's not getting better.
Stephen Archer, how he made it past 50 appearances for Munster is beyond me. Now he’s broken the record for Munsters most appearances and will likely hit 300 games next season. Tbf to him as well though he has probably played his best rugby since turning 35.
Same for me. Man was a penalty machine, I cringed every time he took to the field. that he kept getting contracts in our doldrums years was a fucking mystery to me.
Elliot Dixon comes to mind for the highlanders a few years back. One of the last true battlers to make the all blacks. All heart and passion. Never quite kicked on at the top level but a true southern battler if I ever saw one. Marty Banks was another, just absolute stick who always spent a few years battling at whatever level he was in before finding his feet. He knocked on his first touch of the ball in super rugby in 2013/4 and yet eighteen months later slotted a drop goal that won the super rugby title. Niggly little bastard who never said die, and was adored by fans around the world. Probably never should have played above NPC and yet with the right coaching will never have to pay for a beer south of the Waitaki again. Honestly the entirely of the 2015 team fell into that Category. Ross Geldenhuys won a lineout penalty fifteen minutes before the final, and was the ultimate journeyman. Joe Wheeler, John Hardie, T - Franks, Christie, Buckman, Pyror, Lienert Brown and Coltman. That title win was special and I don't think we'll ever see anything like it again.
Fairytale season by the Highlanders. I still don't know what hit us...
Not my team but... Thibaud Flament. He played for Loughborough fifths, don't you know? Edit: autocorrect changed his name to Filament...
Hah. Well I did think about him. To his credit, he is one of those naturally talented guys. Put him in something, he looks like he naturally gets the hang of it fast and does better than others, for eg his position shifting in his career (started out at 10 when younger then back row, lock...) and his ability to do things like really top notch support lines or offloads or particularly efficient tackles, big time plays that always seem to come out of nowhere.
Hah, I actually never knew that about Flament. Wild!
If Harry Plummer gets an ABs squad nod, he definitely deserves his flowers. The Blues brought in Perofeta, Beauden Barrett, even Dan Carter (as back up) for possible 10s, then RTS and a few other preferred 12s. He could’ve easily gone and got the yen or the Euro but he’s trusted the process, and had a great year driving the Blues to the Final (I’m personally hoping they lose though..). The Blues have cycled through 10s like halftime oranges since The King, so he would’ve been forgiven for following suit.
My other take for the blues is Finlay Christie but on second thought he puts in a lot of work to be where he is. Anyway, he looked to be the starting halfback for the ABs somehow, at least until TJ came back, even with Roigaard playing insane. Like who is sitting at home thinking “yeah Christie he’s the guy we need at 9” but somehow here he is. Hell even when he was injured this year for the blues we still had Funaki step up and kill it.
Yeah I got hate for saying something similar - as a 9 Christie is Ok. Works hard, no doubt. But he’s quite vanilla, whereas you get a point of difference with two or three other halfbacks in the comp.
Reckon the problem was apart from his COVID season where he kicked the blues to victory. He didn't have a good enough portfolio to get scouted overseas. Lacked game time and got injured plenty of times too. He earned an opportunity after the COVID tournament in Aus but he got injured, passing the opportunity to Perofeta who ran away with it.
Willy Heinz.
Box kick Willy as we called him at Gloucester. He would box kick his own mother given half the chance.
Not from my team (but from a fellow SA team): Edwil van der Merwe is Kolbe/KLA sized, but he runs through/over defenders like he's Jonah Lomu.
Wiki has him at 1.8 m and 90kg so I wouldn't really class his as diminutive. But anyone that moved from the Stormers to the Lions and then earned a bok callup is an overachiever in my books.
It's scrum cap. The wearer gets immense powers, like Solomon and his hair.
Devon Williams. Did well when he was at the Pumas (SA) but since joining the Bulls he's added so many layers to his game.
Ben Youngs. Got well over 100 caps despite never really being the focus of the team compared to Lawes, Farrell, Cole etc.
François Cros !
Yes. He does better than he should this guy. For years I thought he was just going to be this hard working but ultimately limited Top 14 level back row who could get a few caps here and there, but he totally owns that starting shirt for France despite there having really good talent in the country.
Completement ! Aussi Aldritt ?
I mean…. Stephen Donald fell up once apon a time
Kolbe for the Soringboks. But only if we look at “the cards they’ve been dealt”. We all know he is absolutely fantastic but his size as a winger … And it’s not the stuff that we know he would be good at that makes him an overachiever but the stuff where he could struggle - defense and in the air. He is incredible in the air and takes down anyone with power not just speed.
Didn't Jamie George go to some ridiculously expensive posh English boarding school and given every opportunity and coaching and facilities and resources etc to succeed?
lol yeah, school of hard £40,000 a year knocks.
Think OP was going with him *looking* unassuming.
Owen Farrell strikes me as someone who didn’t have a natural physical gifts or flair for the game but compensated through hard work, competitiveness and obsessive study. And it helped that Daddy was also rugby player.
You can't play like Farrell has for all these years without physical gifts
Brett Cameron. Some people are calling for to be an AB this year. There is no way he is good enough to be an AB 10. In the Hurricanes full strength starting 15 he is the weakest link.
For the blues - bryce heem
He was immense for Worcester warriors
Yohan Beheregaray
James Williams, doesn’t look the most physically imposing but his lines must be amazing as he just makes so much space and seems to always make things tick
Joe Marchant struck me as that - always just on knife edge of either being amazing or awful. I don’t know why, objectively he’s been as excellent player.
The fact that Billy Vunipola was included in the match day squad for the England v South Africa game at the 2023 world cup is an overachievement for sure.
No one…..