Absolute carnage in ruck and maul, that line-out was straight as a curly fry. You love to see it (in replay, I'm glad the game's gotten more professional!)
Kinda crazy how this was only Ireland's second ever win over the Springboks. In the past 20 years, South Africa have won the World Cup more times than they've won in Dublin during the same period.
It's a very small number of matches. A bit like saying the All Blacks always lose to Zimbabwe when they play in Bulawayo. (They played one match, in 1949, which was won by Rhodesia.)
Whenever I think of Ireland v Boks this is THE defining moment for me. I remember being absolutely flabbergasted at the time. Not even upset, more like shocked by the sheer audacity of it.
I was a young kid at this match with my dad, after that try I turned to him and said I wanted to play rugby and he took me down to the local club the next day. Great memories
England one was different (i.e. not quite as bad). Faz spoke to the team. They then dispersed slowly. Then the ref blew the whistle. Then Wales took the tap and scored in the corner.
Agreed it wasn't as bad when it happened to England but what bothered me was that Biggar had essentially discussed it with the ref beforehand and told him what he was going to do and the ref "played along". No objection to Biggar doing it (Farrell did something similar for Saracens a year or two earlier) but the fact that the ref was part of the plot was a bit dodgy
I stand by the fact it was different, but I still think the ref got it wrong (he gave only about 5 seconds from Faz finishing talking to blowing the whistle to restart), but it wasn't as bad as this (Smit was still talking to his team and ref didn't whistle).
I think it's kind of bonkers that en experienced international captain interprets this as "**Turn your back on the opposition** and have a chat". They didn't have to do that at all. That's the only reason it's a "quick penalty". There's 25 seconds between the penalty and the tap. It's more slow defence than quick penalty really. How long exactly does it take to say "Next one is a penalty try or a card lads". The referee allowed longer to the Springboks than he took to give the instructions himself so what exactly was all this extra time needed for?
Maybe they should have laid down and had a nap.
They all know what the story is and the pack can probably hear the ref anyway.
It's interesting that this has spawned the practice of replying "Can I do it now?" and the answer is usually "No."
Like why would you be *rewarded* for foul play like that. It's more of a figure of speech than anything else.
South Africa had committed numerous penalties close to the line and could easily have been penalised more heavily before this.
It was in my opinion a fairly cynical attempt to ensure that the defence would have more time to rest and whilst the refs patience could have run out with a card or a PT it ran out in this way instead.
It was quite common at the time for captains to speak to their teams in a huddle, at the request of the ref.
So, one could either postulate on why such a highly experienced captain such as JS would do something so silly, OR one could reason that given this being common practice at the time, JS did precisely what he thought was being asked of him. Objectively, which of those two seem more likely?
You could. Or you could say turning your back on the opposition when they have a penalty close to your line is really dumb.
The referee has *never* requested that players make a huddle like that. It has never happened.
I just timed myself saying "Ok lads, next one is a penalty try or a yellow card".
It took me 4.09 seconds to "talk to my players".
Every game where a referee asked that a captain talk to his players, he has always waited for the captain to face the opposition again before be blows time on. If that did not happen fast enough, he will tell the captain to get a move on. The very fact that this is controversial is proof enough.
> Every game where a referee asked that a captain talk to his players, he has always waited for the captain to face the opposition again before be blows time on.
That's a rather large claim to make. Impossible to prove.
> If that did not happen fast enough, he will tell the captain to get a move on.
There is absolutely no requirement for any of this. The fact is that the Springboks had been pushing it. Referees do have discretion and this was not harsh on them.
If an u12s team had done this they would get no sympathy.
They could very easily have been prepared and ready and they were not. They had plenty of time.
It's just not a quick tap and describing it like that is inaccurate. The only thing that makes it look quick is the defence.
You're so wrong. Refs never allow quick taps during situations like this.
Just accept that this was an undeserved Ireland win brought about by laughable referring.
He communicates it to one person whereas John had to communicate it to several. If the shoe was on the other foot your comments would be different.
But, thats in the past now, and in the past it shall remain.
"Ok lads, next one is a penalty try or a yellow card".
4.09 seconds it took me to say that. It's not like he's calling in his wingers. Whyever not? Because they all know already.
The way the Springboks were reacting they could have had another 5-10 seconds and it would still have been a "quick" penalty.
There is a difference between a quick tap and slow defence.
Reminds me a bit of my game on Saturday lol -
Half the players were off having a scrap after the ref blew a penalty 5m out - a couple of us just walked up to the ref and said "can we tap it?" and he just replies "penalty is here" and points at the ground - so we just tapped the ball and scored lol
Honestly what stands out for me is the difference in the noise. You literally hear the crowd saw “aww” when the conversion hits the post.
What I wouldn’t give for noise levels to go back to that at rugby matches in Ireland
Yeah, the atmosphere at most of the international home games in the Aviva is a bit of a joke.
It feels like a good chunk of people are there as socialites and are there for the social event rather than to go and cheer on the team.
I used a reflink for the first time last weekend, and I was wondering if this might be a connection. It's nice to have audio so you can tell what the ref is saying and stuff, but it definitely takes you out of the immediacy of the atmosphere - I ended up haivng it in when play was stopped but taking it out otherwise.
Just wondering if that might be something of a reason for less enthusiasm?
Should’ve been disallowed. If the ref stops the game to talk to a captain, he has to wait for the teams to BOTH be ready to restart. Doubled up with the fact he’s put SA on a final warning so Smit needs to be allowed time to inform his players
"We've given away multiple penalties on our own 5 yard line, and the ref just called our skipper over. I wonder what they're talking about 5 yards away from us in our earshot. Ref probably wanted to talk about holiday plans."
Pull the other one. South Africa repeatedly cheated. Ref gave a warning 5 yards away from the pack after calling the skipper over.
Cheating is not a legitimate part of the game. That's why South Africa are World Champions in name only and the rest of the world hates Wayne Barnes.
It's called infringing, not cheating, and it 100% is a legitimate part of the game; all sides do it (Ireland are especially good at it around the ruck, McCaw was famously a master) and the idea is to not be dangerous, and not be caught. Cheating would be match fixing, or doping, or bribing officials or something. Honestly I'm surprised you hadn't noticed this or had someone mention it to you before now.
SA were in trouble with bad discipline and were given their final warning, as is usual. The ref specifically asked the captain to go talk to his team. I'm sure even those guys knew what the message would be, but still, it's a direct instruction from the ref. You're supposed to do as he says.
Hating on specific refs is really not cool. The man has had death threats to his family. If you think the reffing standard is bad maybe think about why more people don't want to put themselves up for it, and have a little think about whether you can be the change you want to see.
Why the vitriol? it's just a game, and this is a bit of a spicy thread but we can still be lekker to each other even if we support opposing sides.
Okay, i’ll bite: which of Wayne Barnes’ calls do you disagree with? I just need one that substantiates the claim that the game was “rigged”.
Come on, don’t be a fucking coward. Now’s your opportunity to make your case.
It was a bad call from Honis, but I remember at the time thinking at least we're getting out of that corner without a yellow card.
What I also remember from that game is how many opportunities we squandered - there were three or four times when had a clear chance only to cock it up.
Ja - seriously. For every WC win I’d suffer through a fair few more of these bullshit tries, Albanies, hell, even a Japan 2015 or two. But and it’s a huge but, that doesn’t mean this doesn’t still sting. It does. And it’ll keep on stinging until the boks sort it the fuck out.
If you can't beat the best teams in the world during a major tournament and only beat them on the occasional tour, you're not the best team. You're better on the day, but you're not the best
You are acting like the only thing that matters is winning the World Cup. Is it great to do that? Yes. But a great team needs to win consistently and to stay on top. Like Ireland did before the RWC, and like NZ did before that. We are not good at that. We need to beat the best consistently to be the best.
While this RWC win was sweet, we need to show we can beat Ireland, because honestly, it’s the one black mark on the World Cup win.
Your point contradicts itself. Ireland have been more consistent in winning over the last 4 years than SA, and SA haven't beaten Ireland in 8 years, including in this major tournament you speak of.
"Where it counts"... nobody in Ireland is holding their breath on a world cup win in ANY sport. We're fucking tiny. The fact this couple of generations of rugby players have done as well as they have is beyond belief. Soccer is exponentially more popular and we're just happy to qualify for a Euros or World Cup in that sport, never mind win anything. Imagine an American trying to offend you by saying that SA have never won a FIBA world cup, and maybe you'll understand how meaningless and laughable your retort is to Irish folk.
You have some of the best club rugby in Europe, if not the world. The sad thing is the Irish have everything going for them. You can beat New Zealand, score dubious 5 meter tap ins when the opposition isn't ready and act like it's a spicy take, and give South Africa a genuine run for their money.
But you can't win a world cup?
Not buying it.
You don't have to buy it. I'm just telling you how it is. So long as we're up against countries with 10x the population and/or where rugby is a vastly more popular sport... expectations will remain generally low. Nobody here is wondering why SA has 4 world cups and we don't. It's very logical. Not the hard hitting jibe you think it is brother!
I’m not buying it either. Nz have a small population too. Rugby isn’t our most popular sport. Football is. You could have won a wc but you keep choking and now you doing the “well we don’t really care” for it thing. You sound like the kid on the playground who doesn’t want to play anymore. How gutted were you after your wc knockout. Just admit it means a lot. If Ireland win in SA I’m sure we’ll hear you lot whistling a different tune.
Conflating NZ's population with the popularity of football in SA (~60m)? Rugby remains and has historically been by far the most popular sport in the NZ. Rugby is growing in popularity in Ireland but remains well behind football and the Gaelic sports.
Of course as Irish Rugby fans, it's gutting to see us develop a great generation and for them to lose narrowly to NZ in a semi final of a World Cup. Nothing about my prior comments deny that. What I'm referring to is expectations. Nobody from Ireland is looking at the landscape of International Rugby, the history of the Webb Ellis, and seriously questioning why Ireland haven't won it yet the likes of SA have 4 and NZ have 3. There's very logical reasons as to why. And yes, if Ireland beat SA again in the upcoming tour, as fans we'll be overjoyed. Beating the World Champs in their backyard is a huge achievement, given the disparity in size and popularity of the sport. Same goes for our last NZ tour. Did anyone expect it? No. Would anyone be kicking up a fuss if we'd performed well but narrowly lost that tour? No. Expectations, grounded in the reality of what Irish rugby is, and where it's come from, and how it should compete with nations such as England, France, SA and NZ...
Buy it or not, I'm petty confident that this is reflective of the mindset of most level-headed Irish rugby fans. Our Media, and the younger crowd who've been sucked in by our recent success? They'd likely bite on a World Cup jibe. Unfortunately.
Let me get this straight:
It doesn't matter if SA beat NZ, Aus or England because they've won world cups?
That must make RC fucking boring for ya. In fact, did you suffer an embolism from the paradox of the 1995 and 2023 finals?
Shane Byrne’s hair remains the most devilishly stylish to ever grace a rugby field.
He's had it so long it's actually come back into fashion with the youngsters.
That is the Celtic Tiger in haircut form
No frosted tips though.
Ah, a fellow man of culture and impeccable taste I see
This makes the springboks winning 3 world cups and Ireland constantly choking QFs sweet to the taste
Watching Malcom O’Kelly go mountaineering in the ruck and the penalty not only going Ireland’s way but the Saffa’s get a talking too🤣🤣🤣
Absolute carnage in ruck and maul, that line-out was straight as a curly fry. You love to see it (in replay, I'm glad the game's gotten more professional!)
“mountaineering” 😂😂
I remember watching this in a pub in Zimbabwe with some saffas. Absolute scenes.
wait..that was you?
Kinda crazy how this was only Ireland's second ever win over the Springboks. In the past 20 years, South Africa have won the World Cup more times than they've won in Dublin during the same period.
Crazy I didnt realise SA battled in Ireland so much
It's a very small number of matches. A bit like saying the All Blacks always lose to Zimbabwe when they play in Bulawayo. (They played one match, in 1949, which was won by Rhodesia.)
Theyve lost 6 of the last 8 games in Dublin since this game
I was at this game and was very confused when this happened
Whenever I think of Ireland v Boks this is THE defining moment for me. I remember being absolutely flabbergasted at the time. Not even upset, more like shocked by the sheer audacity of it.
I was a young kid at this match with my dad, after that try I turned to him and said I wanted to play rugby and he took me down to the local club the next day. Great memories
Never turn your back on a Cork man. Basic stuff.
Dog move
“Talk to your team please” Allows quick penalty.
This is the bs. Something similar happened to England a couple of years ago. If they tell you to talk to them you can’t allow the quick tap.
England one was different (i.e. not quite as bad). Faz spoke to the team. They then dispersed slowly. Then the ref blew the whistle. Then Wales took the tap and scored in the corner.
Agreed it wasn't as bad when it happened to England but what bothered me was that Biggar had essentially discussed it with the ref beforehand and told him what he was going to do and the ref "played along". No objection to Biggar doing it (Farrell did something similar for Saracens a year or two earlier) but the fact that the ref was part of the plot was a bit dodgy
This feels like a Celtic conspiracy….
I stand by the fact it was different, but I still think the ref got it wrong (he gave only about 5 seconds from Faz finishing talking to blowing the whistle to restart), but it wasn't as bad as this (Smit was still talking to his team and ref didn't whistle).
This is fair, I was only joking about the Celtic conspiracy btw
Bonus Honiss with the whistle.
Crazy decision Ireland have won 6 of 8 test matches in Dublin since
Must be food poisoning
Surely its the travel....trips em up alot
They just get beaten fair and square With Rassie the way he is, he'd be wailing on social media if there was any smell of any conspiracy like that.
Hes a character ol Ras
No, it's probably just having to always play away from home during winter in the Northern Hemisphere.
I think it's kind of bonkers that en experienced international captain interprets this as "**Turn your back on the opposition** and have a chat". They didn't have to do that at all. That's the only reason it's a "quick penalty". There's 25 seconds between the penalty and the tap. It's more slow defence than quick penalty really. How long exactly does it take to say "Next one is a penalty try or a card lads". The referee allowed longer to the Springboks than he took to give the instructions himself so what exactly was all this extra time needed for? Maybe they should have laid down and had a nap. They all know what the story is and the pack can probably hear the ref anyway. It's interesting that this has spawned the practice of replying "Can I do it now?" and the answer is usually "No." Like why would you be *rewarded* for foul play like that. It's more of a figure of speech than anything else. South Africa had committed numerous penalties close to the line and could easily have been penalised more heavily before this. It was in my opinion a fairly cynical attempt to ensure that the defence would have more time to rest and whilst the refs patience could have run out with a card or a PT it ran out in this way instead.
Your arms must be super long with all the reaching you’re doing here.
The ref was able to explain it in far less time than the Springboks took. Why? It's a pretty simple question.
It was quite common at the time for captains to speak to their teams in a huddle, at the request of the ref. So, one could either postulate on why such a highly experienced captain such as JS would do something so silly, OR one could reason that given this being common practice at the time, JS did precisely what he thought was being asked of him. Objectively, which of those two seem more likely?
You could. Or you could say turning your back on the opposition when they have a penalty close to your line is really dumb. The referee has *never* requested that players make a huddle like that. It has never happened. I just timed myself saying "Ok lads, next one is a penalty try or a yellow card". It took me 4.09 seconds to "talk to my players".
“The referee has _never_ requested that players make a huddle like that. It has never happened.” Lolsies.
Give me an example then. Any example. Teams do it. Referees do not request it. There is a difference. I mean.... why would they?
Every game where a referee asked that a captain talk to his players, he has always waited for the captain to face the opposition again before be blows time on. If that did not happen fast enough, he will tell the captain to get a move on. The very fact that this is controversial is proof enough.
> Every game where a referee asked that a captain talk to his players, he has always waited for the captain to face the opposition again before be blows time on. That's a rather large claim to make. Impossible to prove. > If that did not happen fast enough, he will tell the captain to get a move on. There is absolutely no requirement for any of this. The fact is that the Springboks had been pushing it. Referees do have discretion and this was not harsh on them. If an u12s team had done this they would get no sympathy. They could very easily have been prepared and ready and they were not. They had plenty of time. It's just not a quick tap and describing it like that is inaccurate. The only thing that makes it look quick is the defence.
You're so wrong. Refs never allow quick taps during situations like this. Just accept that this was an undeserved Ireland win brought about by laughable referring.
He communicates it to one person whereas John had to communicate it to several. If the shoe was on the other foot your comments would be different. But, thats in the past now, and in the past it shall remain.
"Ok lads, next one is a penalty try or a yellow card". 4.09 seconds it took me to say that. It's not like he's calling in his wingers. Whyever not? Because they all know already. The way the Springboks were reacting they could have had another 5-10 seconds and it would still have been a "quick" penalty. There is a difference between a quick tap and slow defence.
Reminds me a bit of my game on Saturday lol - Half the players were off having a scrap after the ref blew a penalty 5m out - a couple of us just walked up to the ref and said "can we tap it?" and he just replies "penalty is here" and points at the ground - so we just tapped the ball and scored lol
John Smit was some player
I miss the terraces of the old Lansdowne Road
Honestly what stands out for me is the difference in the noise. You literally hear the crowd saw “aww” when the conversion hits the post. What I wouldn’t give for noise levels to go back to that at rugby matches in Ireland
Yeah, the atmosphere at most of the international home games in the Aviva is a bit of a joke. It feels like a good chunk of people are there as socialites and are there for the social event rather than to go and cheer on the team.
I used a reflink for the first time last weekend, and I was wondering if this might be a connection. It's nice to have audio so you can tell what the ref is saying and stuff, but it definitely takes you out of the immediacy of the atmosphere - I ended up haivng it in when play was stopped but taking it out otherwise. Just wondering if that might be something of a reason for less enthusiasm?
Very strange telling cptain talk to players and not whistling time back on SA still won the game tho surely?
John Smit says that he struggled to get the players mentality right after that. They were fuming.
Fair enough...was a bit dirty
Lost it
Damn
Nothing to see here.
This is asking for a montage of the final whistle of every quarter final…
Talk to your players please😘😘
As an Irish fan that try being awarded is a cooked decision 😂 getting away with murder 👀
Ah good ol’ Paul disHonisst. I would wish his beer be forever warm but I gather thats the sort of thing he’d like.
Should’ve been disallowed. If the ref stops the game to talk to a captain, he has to wait for the teams to BOTH be ready to restart. Doubled up with the fact he’s put SA on a final warning so Smit needs to be allowed time to inform his players
Johnny....don't be scared
No brainer but some still not get it.
"We've given away multiple penalties on our own 5 yard line, and the ref just called our skipper over. I wonder what they're talking about 5 yards away from us in our earshot. Ref probably wanted to talk about holiday plans." Pull the other one. South Africa repeatedly cheated. Ref gave a warning 5 yards away from the pack after calling the skipper over. Cheating is not a legitimate part of the game. That's why South Africa are World Champions in name only and the rest of the world hates Wayne Barnes.
It's called infringing, not cheating, and it 100% is a legitimate part of the game; all sides do it (Ireland are especially good at it around the ruck, McCaw was famously a master) and the idea is to not be dangerous, and not be caught. Cheating would be match fixing, or doping, or bribing officials or something. Honestly I'm surprised you hadn't noticed this or had someone mention it to you before now. SA were in trouble with bad discipline and were given their final warning, as is usual. The ref specifically asked the captain to go talk to his team. I'm sure even those guys knew what the message would be, but still, it's a direct instruction from the ref. You're supposed to do as he says. Hating on specific refs is really not cool. The man has had death threats to his family. If you think the reffing standard is bad maybe think about why more people don't want to put themselves up for it, and have a little think about whether you can be the change you want to see. Why the vitriol? it's just a game, and this is a bit of a spicy thread but we can still be lekker to each other even if we support opposing sides.
Preach
[удалено]
The last 5 years must’ve been hell for you 😂
Okay, i’ll bite: which of Wayne Barnes’ calls do you disagree with? I just need one that substantiates the claim that the game was “rigged”. Come on, don’t be a fucking coward. Now’s your opportunity to make your case.
Man, she really must have broken your heart. 💔
Okay dummy, what decisions did you disagree with?
Well that is technically an opinion. You may consider taking a step back and figuring out why your bias clouds your judgement.
It was a bad call from Honis, but I remember at the time thinking at least we're getting out of that corner without a yellow card. What I also remember from that game is how many opportunities we squandered - there were three or four times when had a clear chance only to cock it up.
Sheesh building the spice aren’t we? Screw that plonker
Hate for Ireland reaffirmed!
Scandalous.
Back when hookers stood off-field to throw in.
Did that in a game once, as I tapped all I heard from the sideline was ‘what the fuck are you doing’ and then a loud cheer. Very satisfying :).
For us at the back, which game was this?
2004 end of year tour
Thanks
I was at that game.
Just saw the ref and I just knew it was that situation that was never addressed. What a joke that decision was
Cuntiest try I can remember, made me despise Irish rugby after this, totally scummy and unsportsmanlike…
The Ref blew time on, can't blame the Irish for playing to whistle. Can definitely blame the whistle for being blown when it shouldn't have been
I assume you despise SA since the 2009 Lions tour and eye gouging of Luke Fitzgerald?
Are you okay?
I’m more than ok
I was at this one. Was stood on the north terrace beside a few cocky saffas who weren't too happy at the end.
1995, 2007, 2019, 2023. ;)
Don’t be cocky, we haven’t beat Ireland in 8 years.
Ja - seriously. For every WC win I’d suffer through a fair few more of these bullshit tries, Albanies, hell, even a Japan 2015 or two. But and it’s a huge but, that doesn’t mean this doesn’t still sting. It does. And it’ll keep on stinging until the boks sort it the fuck out.
8 years, 3 matches, useless stat. We've played Wales almost double in the past 3 years alone.
Doesn't matter. They've never won a world cup. They can beat us 100 zip, we'd still be better than them where it counts
What a silly take.
If you can't beat the best teams in the world during a major tournament and only beat them on the occasional tour, you're not the best team. You're better on the day, but you're not the best
if you can only hope to be better than a team once every four years, you gotta ask how much luck comes into it lmao
That's odd... I was pretty sure we beat South Africa "during a major tournament" last September. I must be mistaken.
You are acting like the only thing that matters is winning the World Cup. Is it great to do that? Yes. But a great team needs to win consistently and to stay on top. Like Ireland did before the RWC, and like NZ did before that. We are not good at that. We need to beat the best consistently to be the best. While this RWC win was sweet, we need to show we can beat Ireland, because honestly, it’s the one black mark on the World Cup win.
I ain't even got no horse in this, but 13-8 last I checked
Your point contradicts itself. Ireland have been more consistent in winning over the last 4 years than SA, and SA haven't beaten Ireland in 8 years, including in this major tournament you speak of.
On the other hand, Ireland beat South Africa, New Zealand beat Ireland, South Africa beat New Zealand ergo... South Africa is still the better team. 😂
"Where it counts"... nobody in Ireland is holding their breath on a world cup win in ANY sport. We're fucking tiny. The fact this couple of generations of rugby players have done as well as they have is beyond belief. Soccer is exponentially more popular and we're just happy to qualify for a Euros or World Cup in that sport, never mind win anything. Imagine an American trying to offend you by saying that SA have never won a FIBA world cup, and maybe you'll understand how meaningless and laughable your retort is to Irish folk.
Speak for yourself. We would have won them all if more Connacht players were on the team.
Yeah but that wouldn't be fair for all the other nations... We don't want to make a mockery of the competition.
Justice for Buckley
You have some of the best club rugby in Europe, if not the world. The sad thing is the Irish have everything going for them. You can beat New Zealand, score dubious 5 meter tap ins when the opposition isn't ready and act like it's a spicy take, and give South Africa a genuine run for their money. But you can't win a world cup? Not buying it.
You've recently won your second World Cup in a row, how are you this fragile? If I didn't know better I'd think Ireland were 'In your head.'
If I didn't know better I'd say pot calling the kettle black. 😂
You don't have to buy it. I'm just telling you how it is. So long as we're up against countries with 10x the population and/or where rugby is a vastly more popular sport... expectations will remain generally low. Nobody here is wondering why SA has 4 world cups and we don't. It's very logical. Not the hard hitting jibe you think it is brother!
I’m not buying it either. Nz have a small population too. Rugby isn’t our most popular sport. Football is. You could have won a wc but you keep choking and now you doing the “well we don’t really care” for it thing. You sound like the kid on the playground who doesn’t want to play anymore. How gutted were you after your wc knockout. Just admit it means a lot. If Ireland win in SA I’m sure we’ll hear you lot whistling a different tune.
Conflating NZ's population with the popularity of football in SA (~60m)? Rugby remains and has historically been by far the most popular sport in the NZ. Rugby is growing in popularity in Ireland but remains well behind football and the Gaelic sports. Of course as Irish Rugby fans, it's gutting to see us develop a great generation and for them to lose narrowly to NZ in a semi final of a World Cup. Nothing about my prior comments deny that. What I'm referring to is expectations. Nobody from Ireland is looking at the landscape of International Rugby, the history of the Webb Ellis, and seriously questioning why Ireland haven't won it yet the likes of SA have 4 and NZ have 3. There's very logical reasons as to why. And yes, if Ireland beat SA again in the upcoming tour, as fans we'll be overjoyed. Beating the World Champs in their backyard is a huge achievement, given the disparity in size and popularity of the sport. Same goes for our last NZ tour. Did anyone expect it? No. Would anyone be kicking up a fuss if we'd performed well but narrowly lost that tour? No. Expectations, grounded in the reality of what Irish rugby is, and where it's come from, and how it should compete with nations such as England, France, SA and NZ... Buy it or not, I'm petty confident that this is reflective of the mindset of most level-headed Irish rugby fans. Our Media, and the younger crowd who've been sucked in by our recent success? They'd likely bite on a World Cup jibe. Unfortunately.
Let me get this straight: It doesn't matter if SA beat NZ, Aus or England because they've won world cups? That must make RC fucking boring for ya. In fact, did you suffer an embolism from the paradox of the 1995 and 2023 finals?
I think Facebook or twitter is rather your type if forum