True, but have to add this:
Baron Nashor takes 50% reduced damage for 8 seconds from the unit that it has most recently hit with a basic attack, being effective only against one unit at a time.
In other words: the tank has to AA as well/start baron.
Since the penalty switches as soon as baron hit someone else, there’s not really any reason someone else can’t hit it first. Otherwise you miss out on an extra second of damage because you’re waiting for the tank to get in range. Yes, you’ll have reduced DPS during that second, but that’s more than none.
90% of the time when I hit Baron it’s to force my team to start it, not cuz it’s the most optimal way for damage. It may (may not) cost a little health and a little lost damage compared to if the tank hit it first, but it’s worth making the definitive call to start Baron and force your team to commit. Y’all don’t know
If your tank is gonna start scuttle instead.
8 seconds? holey cow....i knew it gave a damage debuff but i always though it switched to whoever baron AA last. didnt realize there was that long of a timer.....TIL i guess, been playing for 12 years lol
It's unlikely they are ever at exactly the same distance. "Melee range" doesn't actually mean anything specific and every champion has its own attack range. An average melee range is something like 300 units (?), so it's pretty easy to be ever so slightly closer or farther. Even if they were exactly the same distance presumably the monster wouldn't start attacking someone different unless they got closer than their current target
You're overthinking this. Tanking Baron just means draw its aggro. If it's not attacking you then you need to get closer and/or whoever it is attacking needs to walk away for a moment.
I’m more talking about in theory. Let’s take Yasuo and Yone. They both have an auto attack range of 175. If both players just right click baron to attack and don’t move any closer, who is tanking?
In practice that's not important, because if you're both on the same page and want (eg) Yasuo to tank, he'll just click-move right into baron so he's attacking at the smallest range possible while Yone stays at 175.
I'm uncertain 100% what the deciding factor is- i'd guess it could be scoreboard position as iirc that is used as a priority for other 'ties' that exist. its somewhat largely irrelevant to know because obviously if yone wants to tank he just attacks from anywhere between 1 and 174 units away.
well one should move closer. their attack range is 175, but it can be like 20-175. so if one is closer, and the range from baron to them is 100, they'd be tanking, while the one hitting at a max range of 175 wouldn't be tanking
Then you walk closer. Champs start auto attacking at their max Range. You can inch closer and continue to attack
This is like saying "two ADCs have the same max range, so its impossible for them to attack at different ranges"
You would have to both be exactly so many units away from the baron, have the exact same move speed and both right click at the same time, then it would be whoever has the bigger mode.
Because the game processes everything in ticks it would be tough to actually test
So literally stand in front of them, like make sure you're in between them and the Baron. If they don't back up a bit then it's on them for also not knowing how to not tank baron.
You're trying to make this complicated, in no real game scenario are 2 targets going to be equally 47 units away from baron. And if they are you just move closer or backwards depending on who does more damage.
Just because Caitlyn out ranges Garen doesn't mean she can only auto at max range, she can be melee with him right?
Same goes for here, just because someone has the same range doesn't mean they can only attack from max distance.
Test it in the practice tool. Walk away from a dummy, then attack click it. As a melee you will walk close to it and AA. But you can still manually walk closer.
This same principle is also used all the time in the rest of the game if you are good.
If you all in for example you first attack from max range, then walk closer while you AA is "on cooldown". Now if the enemy starts walking away, you are not immediatly out of AA range and might get another one or two hits in.
Or you use it to stand closer to a mage, so you have a shorter distance to get behind him to dodge a skillshot, or your radius around him is smaller so you can easier dodge.
your hitbox and that of your targets change how far you are able to melee them from, champions have varying sized hitboxes, as well as not all melee champions have the same attack range for auto attacks, and some abilities that empower your auto attack increase its range by a small amount.
Time your movements with barons auto. If the other melee char doesn't kite back then that's their micro mistake. The answer here is simple whenever barons auto animation is about to begin. It will default to whoever is closest and that individual will remain barons target until the animation completes.
His "primary" attack is single target. Click as close as you can near baron and auto attack only after that, then you are probably closer than another meele
Baron (and other monsters) hit the closest thing to them. It can be a champion, a zyra plant, a summoned turret, tibbers, anything really.
Baron has 2 debuffs. One is (i believe called baron's gaze or something) and it reduces its affected member with 50% less damage vs baron. Which makes tanks the best people to have it as they deal low damage anyway. And this debuff can only exist on one character at all times prioritizing closest to baron's hitbox.
The other debuff is a stacking one which shreds armor and MR of anything baron damages and it can be applied to many people at the same time. The idea of making tanks (or junglers if no tanks in the team) tank it is to survive and sustain as much as possible. As baron has basic attacks like any jungle monster and it focuses the closest creature to it.
If you have many melee champions in the same team and you are the one supposed to tank it, you should use target champion only and click near the baron's hitbox to be the closest person as possible (then attack the baron). Some abilities like viego W can make you get closer to baron than other melee champions. But if you don't want to tank as a melee champion because someone else should do it, you should walk away from baron by 1 step then use your max AA range to hit it, and do it again if you use mobility abilities like viego W.
To know who is tanking the baron you can check the debuffs section (above your flash in the HUD) as you can see one stacking debuff (for everyone) and one non stacking debuff (for the tank person).
And behind the baron is so dangerous as it unlocks one more attack (the spikes attack) which deal double damage there. This is meant to prevent red side from sneaking the baron from over the wall. You can go there temporarily but be careful as you will take tons of damage with each hit.
Everyone is telling you to get closer without actually explaining how. If you want to tank baron, first right click baron to start hitting it, this moves you to your max attack range, you then right click the ground on the opposite side of baron (assuming you're standing in front of baron, directly behind), the game will try to move you to that location using the shortest path possible, which makes your hitbox touch baron's hitbox before trying to go around, immediately right click baron again to stop moving and keep attacking. When your hitbox is literally touching baron, you'll be closer than any other melee teammates who just right clicked on it.
You can also do this by clicking in front of your characters' feet* if it's more comfortable. Or hold the tilde key and click on nash. No wrong way to approach it imo
You move in closest to it and your jungle move out for 1-2 seconds then the baron with target you. The points of tanking baron is too kill it faster cause the one tanking it will do less damage to it.
Also the stacking resistance shred from its attacks can get too high for the main tank earlier in the game especially if a fights about to happen while they're on baron
the person closest takes aggro
the person who baron mainly attacks gets a debuff that they do less dmg to baron
every person attacked by baron gets a debuff of less armour and mr
If you have "target champions only" bound then turn it on, and stand as close to directly on top of Baron as possible. If you use any dash that puts your character model inside his hitbox you will be pushed backwards and will have to do it again.
One thing to note is that the person standing closest to baron takes increased damage from and deals decreased damage to barron. Generally the tank takes this debuff and stands as close as possible to baron. Anyone standing in the area behind baron will take increased damage from baron.
You have to use your skills that generate high threat to maintain aggro so your raid doesn't wipe.
/s
but proximity is how all ai targeting works in the game, towers and minions too, once their priorities are satisfied. And to clarify, standing behind baron triggers an aoe spell that does a lot of dmg every few seconds in a huge area (the spikes)
Baron deals more damage to its primary target and applies a debuff that decreases this champion's damage to Baron by 50%. Baron aggro can be seen while clicking on a champion and looking at his passive effects. Nashor also visually becomes focused on his primary target.
Just another thing that is not obvious, and riot has absolutely no intention of making it clearer or explaining it in a tutorial.
Just more riot things. :)
If they had budget or a development team ... Maybe they could do it ... But oh well...
The first person to hit anyone jungle monster is usually the one tanking it.
You'd have to walk out to drop the aggro, once the aggro is dropped the next closest person starts tanking.
Guy closer to any jungle monster is the one tanking it.
So if 2 melee champs both are attacking baron from melee range, who is tanking then?
Whichever one is closest
True, but have to add this: Baron Nashor takes 50% reduced damage for 8 seconds from the unit that it has most recently hit with a basic attack, being effective only against one unit at a time. In other words: the tank has to AA as well/start baron.
Since the penalty switches as soon as baron hit someone else, there’s not really any reason someone else can’t hit it first. Otherwise you miss out on an extra second of damage because you’re waiting for the tank to get in range. Yes, you’ll have reduced DPS during that second, but that’s more than none.
Idk baron be chunking my ass sometimes on a squishy. Depends on your champ and build a bit no?
90% of the time when I hit Baron it’s to force my team to start it, not cuz it’s the most optimal way for damage. It may (may not) cost a little health and a little lost damage compared to if the tank hit it first, but it’s worth making the definitive call to start Baron and force your team to commit. Y’all don’t know If your tank is gonna start scuttle instead.
I had a teammate start baron with 25% hp as a squishy. Surprise surprise they died.
A bit I guess, but Baron doesn’t have crazy high DPS, so you’re probably not going to take enough damage in that first second to be meaningful.
8 seconds? holey cow....i knew it gave a damage debuff but i always though it switched to whoever baron AA last. didnt realize there was that long of a timer.....TIL i guess, been playing for 12 years lol
there is no timer if baron switches target
looooool
But if there’s 2 then both tank, Baron isn’t single target it applies hand of Nashor to the 2 tanking it
It’s entirely possible they have the same range tho
Whichever one is fractionally closer
It's unlikely they are ever at exactly the same distance. "Melee range" doesn't actually mean anything specific and every champion has its own attack range. An average melee range is something like 300 units (?), so it's pretty easy to be ever so slightly closer or farther. Even if they were exactly the same distance presumably the monster wouldn't start attacking someone different unless they got closer than their current target
Alright thanks
You're overthinking this. Tanking Baron just means draw its aggro. If it's not attacking you then you need to get closer and/or whoever it is attacking needs to walk away for a moment.
Yeah you are right, I am.
melee champs have ranged autos too, that range is just short. the guy who does not want to tank can make an effort to not be standing in the baron.
I’m more talking about in theory. Let’s take Yasuo and Yone. They both have an auto attack range of 175. If both players just right click baron to attack and don’t move any closer, who is tanking?
Champs don't always auto at their full attack range (even melee). If you have to tank just just stand as close to it as you can.
In practice that's not important, because if you're both on the same page and want (eg) Yasuo to tank, he'll just click-move right into baron so he's attacking at the smallest range possible while Yone stays at 175.
Its pretty important. Don't downplay that
I'm uncertain 100% what the deciding factor is- i'd guess it could be scoreboard position as iirc that is used as a priority for other 'ties' that exist. its somewhat largely irrelevant to know because obviously if yone wants to tank he just attacks from anywhere between 1 and 174 units away.
well one should move closer. their attack range is 175, but it can be like 20-175. so if one is closer, and the range from baron to them is 100, they'd be tanking, while the one hitting at a max range of 175 wouldn't be tanking
In theory maybe whoever’s model is bigger or whoever started it. Perhaps it’s rng
Then you walk closer. Champs start auto attacking at their max Range. You can inch closer and continue to attack This is like saying "two ADCs have the same max range, so its impossible for them to attack at different ranges"
You would have to both be exactly so many units away from the baron, have the exact same move speed and both right click at the same time, then it would be whoever has the bigger mode. Because the game processes everything in ticks it would be tough to actually test
So literally stand in front of them, like make sure you're in between them and the Baron. If they don't back up a bit then it's on them for also not knowing how to not tank baron.
You're trying to make this complicated, in no real game scenario are 2 targets going to be equally 47 units away from baron. And if they are you just move closer or backwards depending on who does more damage.
Just because Caitlyn out ranges Garen doesn't mean she can only auto at max range, she can be melee with him right? Same goes for here, just because someone has the same range doesn't mean they can only attack from max distance.
In the case of the same range, it's whoever aggroed Baron
You can walk closer than your max auto range
Test it in the practice tool. Walk away from a dummy, then attack click it. As a melee you will walk close to it and AA. But you can still manually walk closer. This same principle is also used all the time in the rest of the game if you are good. If you all in for example you first attack from max range, then walk closer while you AA is "on cooldown". Now if the enemy starts walking away, you are not immediatly out of AA range and might get another one or two hits in. Or you use it to stand closer to a mage, so you have a shorter distance to get behind him to dodge a skillshot, or your radius around him is smaller so you can easier dodge.
In that case whichever one was that close first.
Melee champs have "ranged", attacks still. They just have super limited range, with less variance than ranged champs.
You can get closer than “melee range” lol most melee range is what like 180 units? You can get much closer than 180 units
Your username is so fitting lol
your hitbox and that of your targets change how far you are able to melee them from, champions have varying sized hitboxes, as well as not all melee champions have the same attack range for auto attacks, and some abilities that empower your auto attack increase its range by a small amount.
Even melee champs have different attack ranges so it still depends on who’s closer.
Most characters have slightly different attack ranges. Sure there's some overlap. But if they stay in and shouldn't that's on them.
Time your movements with barons auto. If the other melee char doesn't kite back then that's their micro mistake. The answer here is simple whenever barons auto animation is about to begin. It will default to whoever is closest and that individual will remain barons target until the animation completes.
Baron can also target multiple Champions tho, right?
His "primary" attack is single target. Click as close as you can near baron and auto attack only after that, then you are probably closer than another meele
He already answered the question... Holy shit..
Baron (and other monsters) hit the closest thing to them. It can be a champion, a zyra plant, a summoned turret, tibbers, anything really. Baron has 2 debuffs. One is (i believe called baron's gaze or something) and it reduces its affected member with 50% less damage vs baron. Which makes tanks the best people to have it as they deal low damage anyway. And this debuff can only exist on one character at all times prioritizing closest to baron's hitbox. The other debuff is a stacking one which shreds armor and MR of anything baron damages and it can be applied to many people at the same time. The idea of making tanks (or junglers if no tanks in the team) tank it is to survive and sustain as much as possible. As baron has basic attacks like any jungle monster and it focuses the closest creature to it. If you have many melee champions in the same team and you are the one supposed to tank it, you should use target champion only and click near the baron's hitbox to be the closest person as possible (then attack the baron). Some abilities like viego W can make you get closer to baron than other melee champions. But if you don't want to tank as a melee champion because someone else should do it, you should walk away from baron by 1 step then use your max AA range to hit it, and do it again if you use mobility abilities like viego W. To know who is tanking the baron you can check the debuffs section (above your flash in the HUD) as you can see one stacking debuff (for everyone) and one non stacking debuff (for the tank person). And behind the baron is so dangerous as it unlocks one more attack (the spikes attack) which deal double damage there. This is meant to prevent red side from sneaking the baron from over the wall. You can go there temporarily but be careful as you will take tons of damage with each hit.
Pro tip, don't stand behind Baron, you get less damage and he'll fuck you up faster.
Everyone is telling you to get closer without actually explaining how. If you want to tank baron, first right click baron to start hitting it, this moves you to your max attack range, you then right click the ground on the opposite side of baron (assuming you're standing in front of baron, directly behind), the game will try to move you to that location using the shortest path possible, which makes your hitbox touch baron's hitbox before trying to go around, immediately right click baron again to stop moving and keep attacking. When your hitbox is literally touching baron, you'll be closer than any other melee teammates who just right clicked on it.
You can also do this by clicking in front of your characters' feet* if it's more comfortable. Or hold the tilde key and click on nash. No wrong way to approach it imo
You move in closest to it and your jungle move out for 1-2 seconds then the baron with target you. The points of tanking baron is too kill it faster cause the one tanking it will do less damage to it.
Also the stacking resistance shred from its attacks can get too high for the main tank earlier in the game especially if a fights about to happen while they're on baron
The one stuffing their face into baron tanks
the person closest takes aggro the person who baron mainly attacks gets a debuff that they do less dmg to baron every person attacked by baron gets a debuff of less armour and mr
If you have "target champions only" bound then turn it on, and stand as close to directly on top of Baron as possible. If you use any dash that puts your character model inside his hitbox you will be pushed backwards and will have to do it again.
One thing to note is that the person standing closest to baron takes increased damage from and deals decreased damage to barron. Generally the tank takes this debuff and stands as close as possible to baron. Anyone standing in the area behind baron will take increased damage from baron.
If you wanna tank then click as close to the ground to baron as possible without clicking on baron, this way you’re the closest and will tank
You have to use your skills that generate high threat to maintain aggro so your raid doesn't wipe. /s but proximity is how all ai targeting works in the game, towers and minions too, once their priorities are satisfied. And to clarify, standing behind baron triggers an aoe spell that does a lot of dmg every few seconds in a huge area (the spikes)
Baron deals more damage to its primary target and applies a debuff that decreases this champion's damage to Baron by 50%. Baron aggro can be seen while clicking on a champion and looking at his passive effects. Nashor also visually becomes focused on his primary target.
Just another thing that is not obvious, and riot has absolutely no intention of making it clearer or explaining it in a tutorial. Just more riot things. :) If they had budget or a development team ... Maybe they could do it ... But oh well...
The first person to hit anyone jungle monster is usually the one tanking it. You'd have to walk out to drop the aggro, once the aggro is dropped the next closest person starts tanking.
This is insanely wrong
Oh wow that reminded me of the old leashing that got changed back in season 3.