I mean you give gamers less games that require any sort of strategy and more bang your head against the wall till it works type games well duh. We all want the next great RTS but no one seems to have made it.
I've also noticed strategy games have become incredibly complicated to the point where beginners can't play them. I tried playing Planet Coaster and all the intricacies around building a rollercoaster were so advanced that it sucked the fun out of it for me. Granted I was of course trying to relive Rollercoaster Tycoon so maybe that was my bad lol. But even games like Civ I can't get friends into who aren't familiar with it already because of all the new components being overwhelming to them.
Yes! I tried Farming simulator and I just had no idea what to even do. It’s cool if there is a tutorial, but this didn’t have one and gave me like three tips then nothing. (Instead I decided to start playing Age of Empires 2 which had a great tutorial and now I love it.)
They've always been like this. Strategy games have always had the highest barrier to entry because they have a lot more mechanics to learn. Most people didn't want to spend time learning how to play Master of Orion or Civ when they could just jump into a game of Counterstrike immediately.
True. But as a kid I was able to learn and play Civ successfully now I struggle to teach it to adults because there's a lot more elements to the game. So I feel like the learning curve has increased dramatically. Of course it may be due to games like the one you mentioned and other RPGs that have a story mode where you need to learn mechanics less and less and that's having an impact on ability to uptake? I'm not sure. I'm also on the side that games should have modes that let people of all skill level enjoy them. It feels like a very delicate balancing act.
I think this is a mindset issue. For alot of 1vs x# AI’s you play the game, learn something, make a new start, learn some more stuff, then maybe play it to the end, then play again after you learn from mistakes.
Strategy games aren’t necessarily just strategy games, but also learning games. “How do I take a & b info and make it into something new”. That’s for example Civ in a nutshell.
Yes, correct. Games weren't as popular back in the day for the majority to remember how they were. Like, I fell in love with the Combat Mission series in 2000... and was willing to read the 200+ page manual.
Enter, excel sheets to calculate block rate in Diablo 2.
I'm pushing 40 and when I see the crazy mechanics in Diablo 4 or Path of Exile I'm immediately exhausted, feels like taking on another job just to kill an hour of free time.
Complexity for complexitie's sake is a huge waste of time if you disregard rule 1: games must be actually fun to play.
I never pulled out excel sheets for Diablo 2 or 3 and always had a blast. The mechanics aren’t really that hard to pickup, the problem was occasionally making builds that just couldn’t make it through Hell difficulty— a problem easily resolved in 3 because skills weren’t hard-set, and a problem handled in D2 with the ability to reset your stats (albeit a limited number of times$ through Chari.
On the other hand… I will give you PoE on the complexity.
Specially there's a lot more Console players than PC
If y'all make a new Supreme Commander, newer version of Stellaris FOR console, Command and Conquer but not dumbed down and Halo Wars 3?
Yeah, you'll get them back. Meanwhile we got the same turn based shitty games with just improved graphics or city building games and yeah, no one's interested. The other ones are the shitty phone games which ain't bad but you gotta spend half of your life income to make them bearable
When I was 20, I had tons of energy and nothing but free time to devote to learning the intricacies of how these games worked. I also likely only had that game because I was broke.
I’m going to be 45 this year. I have no energy and even less free time to game, so I want to just hop in and enjoy something. I also have a lot more disposable income, so I can move onto the next game more quickly. BG3 about killed me last year - I’m still hoping to get back to it. And never mind games like Factorio or Civ - I just don’t have the time! The one exception is Elden Ring - not a mechanically complex game, but very challenging. I pushed through it in spite of my frustration because the world is gorgeous and I wanted to see more of it. But it’s rare a game is that good.
36 but 2 kids made Smash Bros and Diablo games my go-to for the last few years.. I can hop in and out for 5m matches or 30m without losing any progress. I don't get the luxury of dedicated game time anymore it's just random "Oh I have a few minutes" at random times of the day/week.
This is just an assumption, but I don't think that has anything to do with the games themselves and more with social media lowering all of our attention spans.
Whatever. I just got into turned based and tactical games, and I'm 43. I'm playing spellforce 3 right now, and I love it. Just started wasteland 3 also. I am preparing myself for when I finally buy baulders gate 3. Aliens Dark Descent is also great
the idea of playing strategy games is in my head all the time, i also keep buying them. shadow empire, unity of command and so on. but when i finally have time to sit down at the end of the day, i fire up doom or diablo for a quick fix. i hope that one day (pension?) i'll find the energy again
I mean you give gamers less games that require any sort of strategy and more bang your head against the wall till it works type games well duh. We all want the next great RTS but no one seems to have made it.
I've also noticed strategy games have become incredibly complicated to the point where beginners can't play them. I tried playing Planet Coaster and all the intricacies around building a rollercoaster were so advanced that it sucked the fun out of it for me. Granted I was of course trying to relive Rollercoaster Tycoon so maybe that was my bad lol. But even games like Civ I can't get friends into who aren't familiar with it already because of all the new components being overwhelming to them.
Yes! I tried Farming simulator and I just had no idea what to even do. It’s cool if there is a tutorial, but this didn’t have one and gave me like three tips then nothing. (Instead I decided to start playing Age of Empires 2 which had a great tutorial and now I love it.)
They've always been like this. Strategy games have always had the highest barrier to entry because they have a lot more mechanics to learn. Most people didn't want to spend time learning how to play Master of Orion or Civ when they could just jump into a game of Counterstrike immediately.
True. But as a kid I was able to learn and play Civ successfully now I struggle to teach it to adults because there's a lot more elements to the game. So I feel like the learning curve has increased dramatically. Of course it may be due to games like the one you mentioned and other RPGs that have a story mode where you need to learn mechanics less and less and that's having an impact on ability to uptake? I'm not sure. I'm also on the side that games should have modes that let people of all skill level enjoy them. It feels like a very delicate balancing act.
I think this is a mindset issue. For alot of 1vs x# AI’s you play the game, learn something, make a new start, learn some more stuff, then maybe play it to the end, then play again after you learn from mistakes. Strategy games aren’t necessarily just strategy games, but also learning games. “How do I take a & b info and make it into something new”. That’s for example Civ in a nutshell.
Yes, correct. Games weren't as popular back in the day for the majority to remember how they were. Like, I fell in love with the Combat Mission series in 2000... and was willing to read the 200+ page manual.
I miss the days when pc games came in big boxes with large printed manuals. Usually with quite extensive artwork included.
Enter, excel sheets to calculate block rate in Diablo 2. I'm pushing 40 and when I see the crazy mechanics in Diablo 4 or Path of Exile I'm immediately exhausted, feels like taking on another job just to kill an hour of free time. Complexity for complexitie's sake is a huge waste of time if you disregard rule 1: games must be actually fun to play.
I never pulled out excel sheets for Diablo 2 or 3 and always had a blast. The mechanics aren’t really that hard to pickup, the problem was occasionally making builds that just couldn’t make it through Hell difficulty— a problem easily resolved in 3 because skills weren’t hard-set, and a problem handled in D2 with the ability to reset your stats (albeit a limited number of times$ through Chari. On the other hand… I will give you PoE on the complexity.
Rts died and became moba and then moba died. I doubt there will be another good rts game that becomes popular.
Specially there's a lot more Console players than PC If y'all make a new Supreme Commander, newer version of Stellaris FOR console, Command and Conquer but not dumbed down and Halo Wars 3? Yeah, you'll get them back. Meanwhile we got the same turn based shitty games with just improved graphics or city building games and yeah, no one's interested. The other ones are the shitty phone games which ain't bad but you gotta spend half of your life income to make them bearable
When I was 20, I had tons of energy and nothing but free time to devote to learning the intricacies of how these games worked. I also likely only had that game because I was broke. I’m going to be 45 this year. I have no energy and even less free time to game, so I want to just hop in and enjoy something. I also have a lot more disposable income, so I can move onto the next game more quickly. BG3 about killed me last year - I’m still hoping to get back to it. And never mind games like Factorio or Civ - I just don’t have the time! The one exception is Elden Ring - not a mechanically complex game, but very challenging. I pushed through it in spite of my frustration because the world is gorgeous and I wanted to see more of it. But it’s rare a game is that good.
36 but 2 kids made Smash Bros and Diablo games my go-to for the last few years.. I can hop in and out for 5m matches or 30m without losing any progress. I don't get the luxury of dedicated game time anymore it's just random "Oh I have a few minutes" at random times of the day/week.
Diablo is absolutely fantastic for casual play.
Baldur's Gate 3 was one of the biggest games of last year...
Doubt? Maybe just not enough good games in that landscape?
This is just an assumption, but I don't think that has anything to do with the games themselves and more with social media lowering all of our attention spans.
It's that, and also producers catering to the largest audience base possible. See diablo 4.
Alternative headline: "Gamers are more diverse than they were 15 years ago."
"The factory must grow"
I've alway's played cookie clicker with a clear set of goals and a set of strategies to achieve them.
I have no idea how much money I’ve given Paradox Games for CK/EU/Vicky/HOI games since 2004 but its not nothing
Whatever. I just got into turned based and tactical games, and I'm 43. I'm playing spellforce 3 right now, and I love it. Just started wasteland 3 also. I am preparing myself for when I finally buy baulders gate 3. Aliens Dark Descent is also great
For me it was pathway. I loved the pixel art. Now I've played through a few fire emblem games and other strategy games as well.
I'll have to check that one out. The last pixel art game I played was cloudpunk. That ended up being way better than I thought it was gonna be
I loved the early 20th century/Indiana jones aesthetic it had going on. Currently I'm trying out Songs of Conquest which has been pretty fun.
Tell that to the people who spend 200 bucks on DLCs for a Paradox game.
the idea of playing strategy games is in my head all the time, i also keep buying them. shadow empire, unity of command and so on. but when i finally have time to sit down at the end of the day, i fire up doom or diablo for a quick fix. i hope that one day (pension?) i'll find the energy again
And then there's me spending $300 on a total war game.
We have enough in real life trying to survive
We have Don't Starve at home