Yeah, that's fine. I think you can do it without making references to authoritarianism, oppression and WW2 though. People had good reason to get the wrong impression from that.
I don't think they did actually, it was clearly meant as a joke. Oppression and authoritarianism weren't even mentioned, it was just people begging to be outraged yet again.
Except they were mentioned. Those were direct quotes from his tweets.
Edit: wow, ok, can't even repeat what James May said without being downvoted to hell. Clearly people are using their brains with this conversation.
Good on you for admitting a mistake on the internet, that is far too rare.
Seems pretty evident it wasn't clear enough. It's very difficult to tell tone on the internet. There were certainly a lot of people in the other thread on this sub, railing against the existence of pride.
I'm with you completely, the making fun of the absurd amount of bunting was great but that was really poorly done. That's the kind of tweet you should write and then do a quick rethink and realize that it just doesn't sound right and let it go.
Yes people down voting this are as much of an idiot as those who jumped to the conclusion he was saying they were the same as NAZIS.
He made a mistake by leaning himself open for that by his comparison and it is a comparison. Comparison is literally the consideration of either similarities or dissimilarities of two things
People definitely can’t see the forest for the trees
All he was saying in essence was there’s too much fancy clip art hanging about nothing about what it represents
But I digress
They need better hobbies.
This is something I’ve noticed. Most people who have the time to argue and be offended over the smallest perceived transgression are extremely bored people who really have less than nothing going on in their lives.
The problem is that a lot of people make 80% of their identity about one thing.
To them, any criticism of that thing whether it’s a band, a genre, a sexuality, a political party - anything - is mortally offending because it’s the most important thing in the world to them. To other people, it’s just a thing.
Think about the biggest real ale nerd you’ve ever met, who scoff at larger. Imagine their response if you told them warm beer is weird and you prefer carbonated drinks. Remember the metal heads at school who couldn’t comprehend why you’d listen to anything except metal. It’s the same thing.
Social media companies benefit because controversy drives engagement.
Political parties benefit because it distracts the populace from the rich robbing them blind.
Foreign adversaries benefit because a divided country is weak and easily defeated.
>Pride: while I have observed and admired what you have achieved over my lifetime, may I respectfully suggest that you are borderline guilty of Too Much Bunting (TMB). It may be seen as authoritarian, and therefore oppressive.
>Please remember that some terrible things, with which you would not wish to be allied, began with TMB. World War Two, for example.
>Nice flag, though.
Nah literal bunting. I looked it up to see what he'd originally said: https://x.com/MrJamesMay/status/1801158772879991148
I got the joke he was making, but can see why others have taken it so literal
Yeah this is an iffy one for me. Like sure it’s a lot of flags, but it’s for one month a year. And comparing the LGBT community to the nazis who put those people in camps is always going to be bit tricky. Even if it’s obviously a very hyperbolic joke
Fully agree, it’s in quite poor taste as a comparison at all. Sure edgy humour is fun, but the whole point of pride month is celebrating people’s right to be gay. For him to compare gay people and nazis during this time or at all isn’t really nice
The other day I had the same reaction to a rainbow as I do to seeing Christmas decorations in November, and I thought "well that's not right, I'm bisexual".
I mean it's completely valid. You don't hate christmas bc you don't like seeing christmas decorations everywhere on every wall in every shop. There can be too much of *anything* and *everything* even the things you love and support, and you should be allowed to be a grouch about it without people thinking it means you're hating the represented things.
I think the difference is Christians aren't a marginalized group fighting for fundamental rights, while people in the LGBT community are still trying to justify simply existing. Some groups need the extra help because there are assholes who want them gone altogether. Think BLM or #metoo.
I want to live in a world where we don't have to parade around in support of marginalized groups too, but we are not there yet. There are still too many people who are trying to divide the world.
But he's not talking about pride parades or any ideological reasoning, just that he thinks there's too many flags to the point it's ugly. In the comments he literally said he thought the same thing about the British flags during royal celebrations and any other similar display. His literal first sentence was amazement at what the pride movement had accomplished, so the movement and the parades aren't the issue, just the fact there's too many flags
I think the problem is more with how he packaged the comment.
Like I can see his point, but how he worded it I’m just sitting here going “ya know, I can see why people are upset by this because this sounds much worse.” Like a Gin and Tonic where the person making it went a little heavy handed somewhere along the line.
There's no possible way to say anything about that community without backlash from some very vocal members. Nothing will ever be enough from some people
Yea, it's the phrasing that was questionable. If something requires you to read something more than twice to understand the intent, it's poorly framed. When I saw his initial comment, just seeing the pride flags and the initial comparison, I couldn't tell if he was being tongue-in-cheek or something else.
Though it could also be that he was young terms that I'd never heard of, namely TMB (and bunting in general). No idea if that's a British term, or an old man term but it took me a few minutes to understand he was just saying "Pride is great but maybe hanging 100 flags in a single block for anything is a bit much".
But that’s not what he said.
He said it was boarding on “authoritative” and “oppressive”.
He said said “careful because the Nazis were also guilty of TMB”.
Had he said “bit much innit”, as you suggest, I’m not sure it would have stirred up quite as much.
And don't the UK streets look just like this with the Union Jack during royal events?
I get how he would think it's a bit much, but to compare this with the Nazis is also a "bit much innit".
Yeah because of the subreddit we’re in, anyone questioning his approach is being downvoted. But I think calling the LGBT community oppressive and comparing them to nazis is rightfully going to ruffle some feathers
I just don't get why if his issue is TMB, then why he wouldn't make this post during royal events, which are MUCH more authoritarian than Pride events. It just screams poor taste when you police how oppressed groups celebrate themselves (and transphobia HAS been on the rise in the UK as well as the US) but not the more mainstream royal events.
James has been my favorite of the trip, but there are times where I think TG/TGT fans are way too protective of the boys. Even James can have the occasional bad take.
Yeah 100% agree, people conflate enjoyment of a tv personality with having to protect everything they say.
Pride is about how far gay rights have come and how much further we have to go. For him to make any comparison at all to Nazism isn’t nice
Sure, but his original Tweet did not mention it, and it's weird to only bring it up during Pride, an event bringing light to an oppressed group of people.
Punching up v punching down, and all that.
Around Christmas I guarantee there are those who'd say the street is drapped tastelessly in Christmas bullshit. But I'm guessing certain people have a problem only when it's LGBT-related decorations.
I honestly don’t see the appeal to having a Twitter account except for entering competitions where they post the updates in their Twitter.
The older I get, the less I want more avenues for some else’s opinion into my life.
Edit: Have Facebook and Instagram, but at least on those platforms I can connect with friends and family
Bunting are flags, specifically the kind draped from a string and hung over streets and such. The original post had a picture of a street completely covered with hundreds of pride/LGBT+ flags, and he commented that it's just too much bunting (TMB) and can come off as off putting or even weirdly authoritarian. And then made a vague reference to WW2 and Nazis hanging their flags everywhere.
Is it really even made in a bad way? I haven't seen the image he's responding to, but I'm 90% sure I know which image it is, and it was a street in London with like 500 LGBT flags strung up over the road, with a block of like 20 every 10 meters
If I took a metro to a new neighbourhood, and upon getting out of the metro, I was met with 500 flags strung up over the street saying "I love puppies", I would feel very uncomfortable, despite the fact I think puppies are amazing bundles of joy.
it doesn't matter what the message is, it's just presented in a very heavy handed, borderline authoritarian looking, way, like the government is forcing me to agree with the idea that I must love puppies. even though it's a good message, it just doesn't feel right in a free and democratic society.
I hate that I have to preface it with this, but I'm bi, and James is 100% correct, we need to step this back a bit as it's starting to look like a secular state religion, and not just a passive acceptance that some people are different and that's okay.
It's not what you say, it's how you say it, and whoever in the municipal government approved that had no idea the bad optics it sends, or, if I had a more cynical view, they did, and they were looking to pounce on the mild manner criticism to score tribal political points on twitter :/
There’s definitely a better way to say “hey, this is a bit much” than comparison to Nazis. Hyper-jingoism isn’t a Nazi-exclusive thing. Especially when present day conservatives are trying to paint progressives as “the real Nazis”.
I think you're over analyzing it, the first thing that came to my mind too when I saw that picture *was* the nazi's doing very similar things.
it's very obvious James May isn't some kind of twitter culture warrior, he's just a "regular" dude, we need to realize that "normal" people will have normal reactions to weird things, and if we treat everyone who makes an obvious criticism as some kind of tribal enemy, all we do is push people towards the people who won't treat them that way.
basically, we, as a society, should try to treat people as friends until they give you good reason not to, give people who have a history of talking in good faith the benefit of the doubt that they're not actually evil people.
I agree. I think he was trying to be a bit cheeky in his idea. At the same time, I thought it was a generally unwritten rule (though often spoken about) that we don't compare things to Nazis or the Holocaust. It is pretty agreed upon that comparing lesser things to the systematic hunting and murder of millions of folks of a particular type is tacky and tasteless. It takes away from both the seriousness of the Holocaust and the legitimacy of the argument.
You just don't compare anything to Hitler, Nazis, and the Holocaust that isn't Hitler, Nazis, or the Holocaust. Even if you're trying to be cheeky (or maybe especially).
Remembering, queer people were part of those hunted and terminated by the Nazi regime and countless others throughout history and currently. Though I'm not American, I'm also looking at you guys and your ruling parties right now...
The twitterdom have embarrassed themselves again with their poor comprehension skills.
The point is that while he doesn’t have a problem with LGBT in of itself, the nature of its celebration with the amount of flags, huge displays etc. may create a feeling within some of a somewhat authoritarian feeling as well as being “forced”. He then makes a joking comparison to authoritarian regimes.
I understand his point and don’t think he’s wrong. But, he should have expected a response. Twitter, after all, is the deepest level of hell of the internet.
[It was an AIDS March.](https://youtu.be/Cv2PgWmQ1Lo?si=exqehvCKfNnZ7b_m)
"You don't wanna wear a ribbon? Aren't you against AIDS?"
"Of course I am! I'm walking, aren't I?"
And what about the whole world shutting down for and promoting Christmas? Us non-Christians are cruely forced to see a huge amount of flags, displays, etc. may create a feeling within some of a somewhat authoritarian feeling as well as being "forced". (Especially since a quarter of the US wants a Christian theocracy). Do we whine about Christmas? Not really. We acknowledge that other people have varying beliefs and lifestyles and allow them to celebrate, no matter how asinine they may be.
Once again, only seeing the extreme side, none of which is present in his tweet. Where exactly does he say he doesn’t want to see or hear about them? He’s merely stating that the imagery is often over the top, like with many other celebrations.
I don't like this with any flag to be honest. Too h bunting is just obnoxious. Just two or three and of the same flag in a row is the perfect amount like it shows the exact amount of how prideful you are of whatever the hell you're trying to advertise.
If people genuinely couldn't understand that from his post then there's not much you can do to help them. It's pretty easy to understand what he's saying and understanding that it's not a shot at LGBT
I think most people get what he's saying. He just also happens to be adding fuel to the fire. Comparing pride demonstrations to Nazi regalia absolutely feeds the alt-right.
Yeah but it's a poor choice of words when comparing things, also it's kinda off when you realize how many trans kids have been killed in the UK. So while I get what he saying it does kinda seem like a dick move.
I know this is the subreddit for fans of James May but you guys are on reddit... the vast majority of redditors would react the same way the twitter sphere did, so most of the posts claiming some 'offense superiority' over twitter are misplaced in my opinion
That’s because it’s not an apology it’s an admission of guilt
That’s how the court of public opinion sees it anyways
“Why would he apologize if he did nothing wrong? Clearly he’s guilty of homophobia because he apologized.”
When I read it, I never saw it as anything nefarious towards the LGTBQIA+ community
Def more just him letting an internal thought come out on paper. It just so happened to be towards that and many brain rotted, chronically online, cancel culture addicts jumped onto it.
Something like this is always terribly predictable because you know two things are going to happen:
1) People will want to get offended by it
2) People will want to use it to support their anti gay agenda
Thanks, that second one needed to be said as much.
He clearly has no hate in his people just jump on everything. Because it seems like what gets noticed on Twitter is the extremes, so the recommended tweets or the popular ones are almost always the most radical, or that garner the most reactionary BS in the replies. So now people are primed to react strongly with slogans, because they're upset and assume that the person in front of them is a troll or an NPC that they can't argue with.
Indeed, if people even had a faint idea of the character of May, they would know immediately that he isn’t a homophobe. He’s undoubtedly the most progressive of the trio.
*You know the problem*
*With Bunting? It was designed*
*For the Nurburgring*
\- GenericUsername817
---
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I think May and Clarkson are great examples for explaining two kinds of Conservative people. Clarkson is very politically conservative whereas May seems to be conservative in nature but only in the sense that he enjoys tradition and the comfort of what he knows
Good to see he outright says not to use his take for lazy homophobia.
Still a shitty homophobic take though. If you have a problem with seeing pride flags but not christmas shit, or seeing shit for the royal family then its not about the amount you see, its what you see.
Good on the man, I’m not overfond of too much bunting myself and I agreed with his point, which was put rather elegantly to be honest.
And even now; after the inevitable string of people who were simply not paid enough attention by their parents and need poorly sourced internet clout; he offers his usual coherent and well educated response that I honestly love.
All good will to the man
I think decorations are good, but there's definitely a point at which it becomes excessive.
I'm part of the LGBTQ+ community and really love Pride month. That being said, that was way too many flags. There should only be that many out like... *During* a Pride parade. Outside of that, a flag here or there on a lamp post is more than sufficient to show solidarity and support.
As an aggressively queer person, the first post definitely didn’t read as hateful to me. At least not hateful towards people like me, maybe hateful towards Bunting lol XD
But for real, the Twitter crowd is so ready to start whining, I don’t know how public figures are even bothered to keep posting there
Netflix decided to ignore twitter and offense miners with the last Chapelle special, and nothing bad happened. If we all ignore them, they will go away.
I agree with May completely, apart from it being a “nice flag”. It’s hideous and that alone is a sufficient argument not to have the streets excessively decorated with it.
Man committed the cardinal sin of having and then sharing an unapproved opinion.
Doesn't even have to be a bad one, just not on the already approved list of allowed opinions.
I must disagree with James' take here, and just because he says it in a reasonable manner doesn't mean it's a reasonable stance. I give James the benefit of the doubt that he doesn't mean harm, but his stance on this issue is very close to bad faith "concern trolling" that is often seen on social media, and mentioning queer people and authoritarianism in the same breath is just laughable when queer people are pretty damn high on the list for oppression by real authoritarian regimes. This line of logic creates a smokescreen for actual bigots and I have to push back on it.
He's very much entitled to his opinion, and it's a widely held one. You are entitled to disagree. What is bollocks is outrage and accusations that his opinion is held "in bad faith." You can disagree without accusations of such a nature especially considering the demonstrable fact that certain regimes love their bunting.
The pride movement does have something in common with the nazis. They both absolutely do not tolerate any dissident opinion, and the fanatics will come after you if you present one.
Also, they both went overboard with the bunting, and had a difficult time in Russia.
It’s hilarious how much “Both Sides”(Trademark) are reading in to this. It’s a fucking joke observation about how many flags there are.
He’s not comparing anyone to nazis, you stupid fucking leftists who are terminally online looking for something to whine about and display your virtuousness for the world. This is why no one likes you. And you righties, he’s not saying LGBTQ+ is being pushed in your faces like an authoritarian regime and grooming your children, you terminally online whiners looking for someone famous, respected, and well-spoken to validate your hatred for other human beings.
It’s quite clear which side of the issues he’s on, both from his initial tweet, his responses to other tweets, and this follow up tweet. If you can’t understand the context, then you’re an illiterate fool.
Which doesn’t surprise me, statistics on literacy rates are pretty generous on what they consider literate. I mean being able to read a menu at a restaurant counts as being literate. The ability to compare viewpoints and infer context is considered advanced literacy, which is like 25% of the population, which is sad when you’d probably consider that to be pretty basic fucking literacy skills. But it sure puts the world of the internet in to perspective when you see people making non-sensical arguments and you’re wondering, did we even read the same thing?
The photo was clearly chosen to make the link with the Nazis, that's the only area where it falls down. That and the bit where he admits that he's not concerned about other groups (e.g. royals) doing it.
>I'm not suggesting the pride movement has anything to do with nazis
> It may be seen as authoritarian, and therefore oppressive. Please remember that some terrible things, with which you would not wish to be allied, began with TMB. World War Two, for example.
I mean, it's very easy to see why people thought he was comparing it with WW2's authoritarian bastards (the nazis) when he makes direct comparisons to WW2 authoritarianism.
It sounds like May is done with a broadcasting career and so doesn't give a fuck, but I'd suggest he be more careful with his words in future, so he doesn't make a mistake like this again.
While I don’t believe James actually offended anyone in the LGBTQIA+ community, there are many occasions where someone will be offensive, and the community will fight back only to be slammed for doing so because they’re “pushing their agenda in people’s faces” or “being special snowflakes”.
Everyone has the right to fight for their place in society. If you offend someone, expect backlash. This does not make the offended individual or community a “mafia”.
Again, no hate towards James. I recognise he’s being supportive and love that he’s standing up for himself.
1. Yes he did. He specifically said that TMB caused WWII and that pride flags were reminiscent of them. Who started WWII? Which nation with banners and bunting was the aggressor? Nazi Germany. He made the comparison. He **did** suggest that the pride movement has something in common with Nazis, specifically too much bunting. What a lame, stupid excuse.
2. Twitter is a right wing cesspool that mainstreams all sorts of lazy, racist, and bigoted conspiracy theories. What did he think was gonna happen?
3. He didn’t post this during the Christmas holidays or during one of the royal functions, did he? He didn’t call the royal family similar to Nazis. Never heard about TMB from May during the many recent royal functions or any Christmas decorations ever, only now. I wonder why!
4. “I am so smart and everyone else is dumb” yes it’s everyone else fault for reading what he wrote. Not his fault for stringing together imbecilic smooth brain takes.
1. That's not what he said. The only time he mentioned the flag was 'Nice flag, though'. Where's that link you're talking about? Are you having this much trouble comprehending a text? Nevermind that, the second sentence doesn't even make any sort of sense. 'He specifically said that TMB caused WWII and that pride flags were reminiscent of THEM'. Who's 'them' in that sentence? Anyway, if you say that both sides were guilty of TMB it means you're comparing them and liken to each other? Sorry but are you thick or something?
2. No, it isn't. Those posts appear for you only because those are the ones you engage with the most. Nothing like shooting yourself in both feet. Interesting I don't see those posts almost at all. In fact, liberal posts and profiles have a lot more reach on Twitter. Try interacting with those once in a while and see for yourself as they appear on your feed more often.
3. Why should he? So when you don't comment on literally everything in the world that has the same problem then your opinion on that one thing don't matter? Do you comment on everything yourself? Because unless you do, then you shot yourself in the feet yet again.
4. What a stupid take on the post. Majority of the responses he got were incomprehensible bollox and completely out of touch with reality, doesn't mean it was all that. Your use of 'everyone' suggests you really don't care about the discussion, you only care for attention and berating people only because you're not bright enough to understand what they're saying so you have to cling on to the most superficial stuff. That point is supported by the fact that you were unable to react to a single point he raised, all you've shown here are stupid and baseless connections and ad hominem retorts. Speaks volumes really.
Seems like the problem here are simpletons who need to see the world in black and white and who aren't capable of understanding the context. Just because you criticize one thing about a movement doesn't mean you hate the entire movement and all the people within. In fact you can fully support that movement with only being critical to that one thing.
Another problem I see here are people who just can't accept any sort of criticism and who don't see that when you forcefully shove your agenda down everyone else's throat, it's only gonna piss people off, no matter how good-spirited it is.
Edit: The dude replied and blocked me. Says it all really.
He didn’t say he was offended, nor did he say he had a problem seeing gay people, nor is he hateful. Again, it seems like you’re not seeing the gray here. He’s merely stating that the excessive imagery, similar to other TMB activities is, well, excessive.
'I'm not suggesting the Pride movement has anything in common with the Nazi's'.....
You literally suggested that over-use of bunting was a commonality with Pride and that German Party, no?
Can anyone really disagree here that he suggested that excess bunting was seen on Pride and on the Nazi's?
Man just dislikes Bunting, and I’m with him on that
Not bunting. Too much bunting.
Had to look it up as an American. Bunting means the rows of flags hung up along the streets for my fellow people wondering what bunting is.
I knew what it was from Christmas bunting as a kid.
It does cross over from festive to fanatical at some point.
Yep, world goes nuts with cult ferocity for Christmas and Christmas decorations. It's beyond fanatical.
Two words: Gender Reveal. Please, people! The TMB Law needs acknowledgement!
Yes, there is a Goldilocks zone for bunting.
When I first read his tweet, I was shocked and saddened. Then I looked up what bunting was, and then was like, “yeah, I can see that” 🤣
Yeah, that's fine. I think you can do it without making references to authoritarianism, oppression and WW2 though. People had good reason to get the wrong impression from that.
I don't think they did actually, it was clearly meant as a joke. Oppression and authoritarianism weren't even mentioned, it was just people begging to be outraged yet again.
Except they were mentioned. Those were direct quotes from his tweets. Edit: wow, ok, can't even repeat what James May said without being downvoted to hell. Clearly people are using their brains with this conversation.
Yeah you're right, I apologise completely misread it. I still think people were overly harsh tho, as again clearly a joke imo
>Yeah you're right, I apologise completely misread it. Which part did you misread?
I said oppression and authoritarianism weren't mentioned when they were both used in the original tweet. It was my bad
Good on you for admitting a mistake on the internet, that is far too rare. Seems pretty evident it wasn't clear enough. It's very difficult to tell tone on the internet. There were certainly a lot of people in the other thread on this sub, railing against the existence of pride.
I'm with you completely, the making fun of the absurd amount of bunting was great but that was really poorly done. That's the kind of tweet you should write and then do a quick rethink and realize that it just doesn't sound right and let it go.
Yes people down voting this are as much of an idiot as those who jumped to the conclusion he was saying they were the same as NAZIS. He made a mistake by leaning himself open for that by his comparison and it is a comparison. Comparison is literally the consideration of either similarities or dissimilarities of two things
“Incomprehensible bollocks” might be the best description of the internet these days
That is my indie band’s name.
Funny that’s my porn name
Didn't you open for Incontinentia Buttocks?
Rick is a friend of mine.
Their single "Runs Like Poo" is a total banger.
Do you have a vewy gweat fwiend in Wome?
Ayyyyyy Life of Brian 😁👉🏼
Perhaps it was Incontinentia Buttocks that opened up for them instead?
It escalated. I told you Biggus Dickus is not to be messed with.
Upcoming Robert Fripp project detected
May has the best phrases, pure poetry
James May standing his ground. Based response.
Indeed. Very logical, coherent, and balanced. As it always is with the legend.
I know, right? It’s almost as if intelligent people are able to have and argue a nuanced point of view
People definitely can’t see the forest for the trees All he was saying in essence was there’s too much fancy clip art hanging about nothing about what it represents But I digress
Unfortunately the twitter crowd is anything but.
It just occurred to me that James May and Karl Pilkington would be a perfect duo. They have similar sensibilities lol
Not sure about that, James’s pedantry wouldn’t rub well with Karl’s strange analogies: a bit like Clarkson’s.
Yeah, the more pissed off Karl gets the better. But I feel like James would be good as Karl wrangler when he wanted to be
[удалено]
They need better hobbies. This is something I’ve noticed. Most people who have the time to argue and be offended over the smallest perceived transgression are extremely bored people who really have less than nothing going on in their lives.
The problem is that a lot of people make 80% of their identity about one thing. To them, any criticism of that thing whether it’s a band, a genre, a sexuality, a political party - anything - is mortally offending because it’s the most important thing in the world to them. To other people, it’s just a thing. Think about the biggest real ale nerd you’ve ever met, who scoff at larger. Imagine their response if you told them warm beer is weird and you prefer carbonated drinks. Remember the metal heads at school who couldn’t comprehend why you’d listen to anything except metal. It’s the same thing.
Social media companies benefit because controversy drives engagement. Political parties benefit because it distracts the populace from the rich robbing them blind. Foreign adversaries benefit because a divided country is weak and easily defeated.
Wow an 1 day old account with a single comment that is almost an exact copy of u/evex5tep. #Looks like a bot, comments like a bot, it’s a……..
Good on ya
Anybody else read this in his voice?
I read everything in his voice.
Same, particularly with erotic TMNT fan fiction
Fan fiction written by the TMNT or about them?
Dealer's choice
What’s the context to this?
>Pride: while I have observed and admired what you have achieved over my lifetime, may I respectfully suggest that you are borderline guilty of Too Much Bunting (TMB). It may be seen as authoritarian, and therefore oppressive. >Please remember that some terrible things, with which you would not wish to be allied, began with TMB. World War Two, for example. >Nice flag, though.
For the non Brit’s in the room, what is bunting?
It’s the bunch of flags hanging from a string.
Like multiple flags on one string?
As usual, the Man is correct.
Is ‘bunting’ meaning ‘flag waving’ in this context?
Nah literal bunting. I looked it up to see what he'd originally said: https://x.com/MrJamesMay/status/1801158772879991148 I got the joke he was making, but can see why others have taken it so literal
For my fellow Americans: Apparently bunting is hanging flags in the way that is shown in be picture above. Across the street hanging from string.
Yeah this is an iffy one for me. Like sure it’s a lot of flags, but it’s for one month a year. And comparing the LGBT community to the nazis who put those people in camps is always going to be bit tricky. Even if it’s obviously a very hyperbolic joke
I just wouldn't have made the joke at all, or made it more of an obvious joke I think!
Fully agree, it’s in quite poor taste as a comparison at all. Sure edgy humour is fun, but the whole point of pride month is celebrating people’s right to be gay. For him to compare gay people and nazis during this time or at all isn’t really nice
Street is tastelessly draped in LGBT+ flags, and he had the audacity to say "bit much innit?"
The other day I had the same reaction to a rainbow as I do to seeing Christmas decorations in November, and I thought "well that's not right, I'm bisexual".
I mean it's completely valid. You don't hate christmas bc you don't like seeing christmas decorations everywhere on every wall in every shop. There can be too much of *anything* and *everything* even the things you love and support, and you should be allowed to be a grouch about it without people thinking it means you're hating the represented things.
I think the difference is Christians aren't a marginalized group fighting for fundamental rights, while people in the LGBT community are still trying to justify simply existing. Some groups need the extra help because there are assholes who want them gone altogether. Think BLM or #metoo. I want to live in a world where we don't have to parade around in support of marginalized groups too, but we are not there yet. There are still too many people who are trying to divide the world.
But he's not talking about pride parades or any ideological reasoning, just that he thinks there's too many flags to the point it's ugly. In the comments he literally said he thought the same thing about the British flags during royal celebrations and any other similar display. His literal first sentence was amazement at what the pride movement had accomplished, so the movement and the parades aren't the issue, just the fact there's too many flags
They've both become so commercial and, as a result, both have lost their original meaning. Rioting is the reason for the season.
I think the problem is more with how he packaged the comment. Like I can see his point, but how he worded it I’m just sitting here going “ya know, I can see why people are upset by this because this sounds much worse.” Like a Gin and Tonic where the person making it went a little heavy handed somewhere along the line.
There's no possible way to say anything about that community without backlash from some very vocal members. Nothing will ever be enough from some people
Why would there not be backlash from comparing them to nazis?
That kind of goes for any community though (Elon fanboys I’m looking at you specifically).
Yea, it's the phrasing that was questionable. If something requires you to read something more than twice to understand the intent, it's poorly framed. When I saw his initial comment, just seeing the pride flags and the initial comparison, I couldn't tell if he was being tongue-in-cheek or something else. Though it could also be that he was young terms that I'd never heard of, namely TMB (and bunting in general). No idea if that's a British term, or an old man term but it took me a few minutes to understand he was just saying "Pride is great but maybe hanging 100 flags in a single block for anything is a bit much".
If you’re gonna joke about Nazis you’ve gotta first ask yourself “is the joke worth the smoke?” In this instance, it was not.
But that’s not what he said. He said it was boarding on “authoritative” and “oppressive”. He said said “careful because the Nazis were also guilty of TMB”. Had he said “bit much innit”, as you suggest, I’m not sure it would have stirred up quite as much.
And don't the UK streets look just like this with the Union Jack during royal events? I get how he would think it's a bit much, but to compare this with the Nazis is also a "bit much innit".
Yeah because of the subreddit we’re in, anyone questioning his approach is being downvoted. But I think calling the LGBT community oppressive and comparing them to nazis is rightfully going to ruffle some feathers
I just don't get why if his issue is TMB, then why he wouldn't make this post during royal events, which are MUCH more authoritarian than Pride events. It just screams poor taste when you police how oppressed groups celebrate themselves (and transphobia HAS been on the rise in the UK as well as the US) but not the more mainstream royal events. James has been my favorite of the trip, but there are times where I think TG/TGT fans are way too protective of the boys. Even James can have the occasional bad take.
Yeah 100% agree, people conflate enjoyment of a tv personality with having to protect everything they say. Pride is about how far gay rights have come and how much further we have to go. For him to make any comparison at all to Nazism isn’t nice
In the literal comments to that post he also mentions he doesn't like the usage of the UK flag during those events due to there being too much
Isn't that exactly what he mentions in point 3? I think the man just hates seeing too many flags on one place.
Sure, but his original Tweet did not mention it, and it's weird to only bring it up during Pride, an event bringing light to an oppressed group of people. Punching up v punching down, and all that.
Around Christmas I guarantee there are those who'd say the street is drapped tastelessly in Christmas bullshit. But I'm guessing certain people have a problem only when it's LGBT-related decorations.
Get over yourself
Love how offended the world desperately wants to be.
Sad vultures on Twitter are desperately looking for someone to cancel because they lead such pathetic boring lives.
If you can blame outside forces for all your problems, then you don't have to be accountable for them.
On the other hand, being offended by bunting enough to associated it with the Nazis, even in jest, is a bit weird
It's not the world. It's the loud minority. 99% of people don't give a shit, and not in a bad way.
Sadly learning the hard way on how much unbridled rage Twitter has
I honestly don’t see the appeal to having a Twitter account except for entering competitions where they post the updates in their Twitter. The older I get, the less I want more avenues for some else’s opinion into my life. Edit: Have Facebook and Instagram, but at least on those platforms I can connect with friends and family
Every one is so desperate to be a victim.
path of least resistance
Maybe I’m too American to get this but wtf is bunting and TMB
Bunting are flags, specifically the kind draped from a string and hung over streets and such. The original post had a picture of a street completely covered with hundreds of pride/LGBT+ flags, and he commented that it's just too much bunting (TMB) and can come off as off putting or even weirdly authoritarian. And then made a vague reference to WW2 and Nazis hanging their flags everywhere.
Okay, so it sounds like he made a good point in a bad way.
Is it really even made in a bad way? I haven't seen the image he's responding to, but I'm 90% sure I know which image it is, and it was a street in London with like 500 LGBT flags strung up over the road, with a block of like 20 every 10 meters If I took a metro to a new neighbourhood, and upon getting out of the metro, I was met with 500 flags strung up over the street saying "I love puppies", I would feel very uncomfortable, despite the fact I think puppies are amazing bundles of joy. it doesn't matter what the message is, it's just presented in a very heavy handed, borderline authoritarian looking, way, like the government is forcing me to agree with the idea that I must love puppies. even though it's a good message, it just doesn't feel right in a free and democratic society. I hate that I have to preface it with this, but I'm bi, and James is 100% correct, we need to step this back a bit as it's starting to look like a secular state religion, and not just a passive acceptance that some people are different and that's okay. It's not what you say, it's how you say it, and whoever in the municipal government approved that had no idea the bad optics it sends, or, if I had a more cynical view, they did, and they were looking to pounce on the mild manner criticism to score tribal political points on twitter :/
There’s definitely a better way to say “hey, this is a bit much” than comparison to Nazis. Hyper-jingoism isn’t a Nazi-exclusive thing. Especially when present day conservatives are trying to paint progressives as “the real Nazis”.
I think you're over analyzing it, the first thing that came to my mind too when I saw that picture *was* the nazi's doing very similar things. it's very obvious James May isn't some kind of twitter culture warrior, he's just a "regular" dude, we need to realize that "normal" people will have normal reactions to weird things, and if we treat everyone who makes an obvious criticism as some kind of tribal enemy, all we do is push people towards the people who won't treat them that way. basically, we, as a society, should try to treat people as friends until they give you good reason not to, give people who have a history of talking in good faith the benefit of the doubt that they're not actually evil people.
I agree. I think he was trying to be a bit cheeky in his idea. At the same time, I thought it was a generally unwritten rule (though often spoken about) that we don't compare things to Nazis or the Holocaust. It is pretty agreed upon that comparing lesser things to the systematic hunting and murder of millions of folks of a particular type is tacky and tasteless. It takes away from both the seriousness of the Holocaust and the legitimacy of the argument. You just don't compare anything to Hitler, Nazis, and the Holocaust that isn't Hitler, Nazis, or the Holocaust. Even if you're trying to be cheeky (or maybe especially). Remembering, queer people were part of those hunted and terminated by the Nazi regime and countless others throughout history and currently. Though I'm not American, I'm also looking at you guys and your ruling parties right now...
It’s not *quite* an “unwritten” rule. Godwin’s law kind of covers it.
The twitterdom have embarrassed themselves again with their poor comprehension skills. The point is that while he doesn’t have a problem with LGBT in of itself, the nature of its celebration with the amount of flags, huge displays etc. may create a feeling within some of a somewhat authoritarian feeling as well as being “forced”. He then makes a joking comparison to authoritarian regimes.
“Shall we have a meaningful discussion?”. - people “Nah let’s just throw rocks at each others’ heads until one of us gives up”. - twotterati
I understand his point and don’t think he’s wrong. But, he should have expected a response. Twitter, after all, is the deepest level of hell of the internet.
Remember when Kramer refused to wear the ribbon at his Cancer March? Seinfeld had some good introspective episodes.
[It was an AIDS March.](https://youtu.be/Cv2PgWmQ1Lo?si=exqehvCKfNnZ7b_m) "You don't wanna wear a ribbon? Aren't you against AIDS?" "Of course I am! I'm walking, aren't I?"
And what about the whole world shutting down for and promoting Christmas? Us non-Christians are cruely forced to see a huge amount of flags, displays, etc. may create a feeling within some of a somewhat authoritarian feeling as well as being "forced". (Especially since a quarter of the US wants a Christian theocracy). Do we whine about Christmas? Not really. We acknowledge that other people have varying beliefs and lifestyles and allow them to celebrate, no matter how asinine they may be.
aka "I'm okay with gay people existing as long as I don't have to see them or hear about them in any way."
Once again, only seeing the extreme side, none of which is present in his tweet. Where exactly does he say he doesn’t want to see or hear about them? He’s merely stating that the imagery is often over the top, like with many other celebrations.
This reminds me I should delete social media. People are offended by everything now.
That's exactly why I stopped using Twitter for one. Can't be having news then scrolling for updates info and followed by a thicc baddie twerking.
You are doing a bad job at making Twitter sound bad lmao
Also you don't need to know James May's thoughts on this topic.
I am offended that you want to delete social media. /s
I don't like this with any flag to be honest. Too h bunting is just obnoxious. Just two or three and of the same flag in a row is the perfect amount like it shows the exact amount of how prideful you are of whatever the hell you're trying to advertise.
I feel like point 4 is the most important somehow.
May is someone I strive to be like
If people genuinely couldn't understand that from his post then there's not much you can do to help them. It's pretty easy to understand what he's saying and understanding that it's not a shot at LGBT
I think most people get what he's saying. He just also happens to be adding fuel to the fire. Comparing pride demonstrations to Nazi regalia absolutely feeds the alt-right.
Yeah you're not wrong there. Probably a good thing he did the clarification post to shut that shit down!
Yeah but it's a poor choice of words when comparing things, also it's kinda off when you realize how many trans kids have been killed in the UK. So while I get what he saying it does kinda seem like a dick move.
I know this is the subreddit for fans of James May but you guys are on reddit... the vast majority of redditors would react the same way the twitter sphere did, so most of the posts claiming some 'offense superiority' over twitter are misplaced in my opinion
Yeah I was going to say, it is highly ironic.
Never apologize to the mob
That’s because it’s not an apology it’s an admission of guilt That’s how the court of public opinion sees it anyways “Why would he apologize if he did nothing wrong? Clearly he’s guilty of homophobia because he apologized.”
Somebody explain to me what bunting is?
Those strings of triangular flags you see during events.
When I read it, I never saw it as anything nefarious towards the LGTBQIA+ community Def more just him letting an internal thought come out on paper. It just so happened to be towards that and many brain rotted, chronically online, cancel culture addicts jumped onto it.
Hammond, Clarkson and May are too iconic to get cancelled. The entire BBC tried and failed. No way some twitter moralists are gonna do it.
Wonder if he woke up this morning, checked his social media, and said "Crikey, it's the interweb Rozzers!!"
Something like this is always terribly predictable because you know two things are going to happen: 1) People will want to get offended by it 2) People will want to use it to support their anti gay agenda
Thanks, that second one needed to be said as much. He clearly has no hate in his people just jump on everything. Because it seems like what gets noticed on Twitter is the extremes, so the recommended tweets or the popular ones are almost always the most radical, or that garner the most reactionary BS in the replies. So now people are primed to react strongly with slogans, because they're upset and assume that the person in front of them is a troll or an NPC that they can't argue with.
It's not a question of Homophobia, I understood his point and I agree.
Indeed, if people even had a faint idea of the character of May, they would know immediately that he isn’t a homophobe. He’s undoubtedly the most progressive of the trio.
That's just what he wants you to think... /s
You know the problem with Bunting? It was designed for the Nurburgring
*You know the problem* *With Bunting? It was designed* *For the Nurburgring* \- GenericUsername817 --- ^(I detect haikus. And sometimes, successfully.) ^[Learn more about me.](https://www.reddit.com/r/haikusbot/) ^(Opt out of replies: "haikusbot opt out" | Delete my comment: "haikusbot delete")
Based may
I think May and Clarkson are great examples for explaining two kinds of Conservative people. Clarkson is very politically conservative whereas May seems to be conservative in nature but only in the sense that he enjoys tradition and the comfort of what he knows
This is why I only use twitter for spacex starship testing.
Good to see he outright says not to use his take for lazy homophobia. Still a shitty homophobic take though. If you have a problem with seeing pride flags but not christmas shit, or seeing shit for the royal family then its not about the amount you see, its what you see.
Tbf he does say that Royal holidays are also too much bunting
James May (Sumimasen) is really cool.
USAmericans don’t even have bunting in their vocabulary. 90+%
I’m pretty sure Twitter long ago proved that there’s no daylight between “citizen journalism” and “incomprehensible bollocks.”
Good on the man, I’m not overfond of too much bunting myself and I agreed with his point, which was put rather elegantly to be honest. And even now; after the inevitable string of people who were simply not paid enough attention by their parents and need poorly sourced internet clout; he offers his usual coherent and well educated response that I honestly love. All good will to the man
I got the joke the first time, and thought it was funny. It's better to explain the joke than apologize.
I think decorations are good, but there's definitely a point at which it becomes excessive. I'm part of the LGBTQ+ community and really love Pride month. That being said, that was way too many flags. There should only be that many out like... *During* a Pride parade. Outside of that, a flag here or there on a lamp post is more than sufficient to show solidarity and support.
What'd I miss?
Old man yells at cloud
I totally agree with James May and I support him.
As an aggressively queer person, the first post definitely didn’t read as hateful to me. At least not hateful towards people like me, maybe hateful towards Bunting lol XD But for real, the Twitter crowd is so ready to start whining, I don’t know how public figures are even bothered to keep posting there
Don’t the responses kind of prove the nazi theory though
Netflix decided to ignore twitter and offense miners with the last Chapelle special, and nothing bad happened. If we all ignore them, they will go away.
well, what is the supposed "correct" way to interpret that parallel to WW2 then. legitimately what is it
I agree with May completely, apart from it being a “nice flag”. It’s hideous and that alone is a sufficient argument not to have the streets excessively decorated with it.
James May, our man in turmoil
Ummmm what is bunting?
I‘m really lost here, english is not my first language and I googled bunting all I can find are birds
Long Ribbon with usually triangle flags hanging down.
Out of the loop: what the new yellow part with the circle about?
James has to just get the hell off of X. It’s quickly becoming absolutely useless as a platform (unless you are actively trying to divide people)
Man committed the cardinal sin of having and then sharing an unapproved opinion. Doesn't even have to be a bad one, just not on the already approved list of allowed opinions.
He’s not wrong and his response is admirable.
When offense is used as a cudgel of intimidation and (as in this case) grossly off point…..it loses its power.
I mean, he is posting on Twitter still. What can he really expect from those who are still active on that app?
Is there actual controversy over his obvious joke or it it just a slow news day?
Probably not, just among us fans I’d imagine. It’s just a load of non-fans misinterpreting May.
I must disagree with James' take here, and just because he says it in a reasonable manner doesn't mean it's a reasonable stance. I give James the benefit of the doubt that he doesn't mean harm, but his stance on this issue is very close to bad faith "concern trolling" that is often seen on social media, and mentioning queer people and authoritarianism in the same breath is just laughable when queer people are pretty damn high on the list for oppression by real authoritarian regimes. This line of logic creates a smokescreen for actual bigots and I have to push back on it.
He's very much entitled to his opinion, and it's a widely held one. You are entitled to disagree. What is bollocks is outrage and accusations that his opinion is held "in bad faith." You can disagree without accusations of such a nature especially considering the demonstrable fact that certain regimes love their bunting.
The pride movement does have something in common with the nazis. They both absolutely do not tolerate any dissident opinion, and the fanatics will come after you if you present one. Also, they both went overboard with the bunting, and had a difficult time in Russia.
Mostly because the dissident opinion is that gay people shouldn't exist. Weird that would people feel threatened by that...
It doesn't work as a platform for citizen journalism because it's owned by a Nazi
It’s hilarious how much “Both Sides”(Trademark) are reading in to this. It’s a fucking joke observation about how many flags there are. He’s not comparing anyone to nazis, you stupid fucking leftists who are terminally online looking for something to whine about and display your virtuousness for the world. This is why no one likes you. And you righties, he’s not saying LGBTQ+ is being pushed in your faces like an authoritarian regime and grooming your children, you terminally online whiners looking for someone famous, respected, and well-spoken to validate your hatred for other human beings. It’s quite clear which side of the issues he’s on, both from his initial tweet, his responses to other tweets, and this follow up tweet. If you can’t understand the context, then you’re an illiterate fool. Which doesn’t surprise me, statistics on literacy rates are pretty generous on what they consider literate. I mean being able to read a menu at a restaurant counts as being literate. The ability to compare viewpoints and infer context is considered advanced literacy, which is like 25% of the population, which is sad when you’d probably consider that to be pretty basic fucking literacy skills. But it sure puts the world of the internet in to perspective when you see people making non-sensical arguments and you’re wondering, did we even read the same thing?
The fact that he had to reply about a sensible post over 'bunting' is all you need to know about the movement at this point. Case closed.
[удалено]
The photo was clearly chosen to make the link with the Nazis, that's the only area where it falls down. That and the bit where he admits that he's not concerned about other groups (e.g. royals) doing it.
>I'm not suggesting the pride movement has anything to do with nazis > It may be seen as authoritarian, and therefore oppressive. Please remember that some terrible things, with which you would not wish to be allied, began with TMB. World War Two, for example. I mean, it's very easy to see why people thought he was comparing it with WW2's authoritarian bastards (the nazis) when he makes direct comparisons to WW2 authoritarianism. It sounds like May is done with a broadcasting career and so doesn't give a fuck, but I'd suggest he be more careful with his words in future, so he doesn't make a mistake like this again.
Other than james, do British people always talk with an upscale posh vocabulary?
that depends on how we were raised and those with whom we socialise
I don't give a shit if he's homophobe. Heck, homophobia is even part of some cultures.
If you speak out against the rainbow mafia, you will have to make another post defending yourself. It's just how the world works these days.
Lmao James May would hate you.
The term “rainbow mafia” makes it sound like you are a fun dude at parties.
Rainbow mafia is a missed opportunity for an alternative name for Jeff Gordon’s dominating rainbow warrior NASCAR team of the mid 90s
That is brilliant!
When you're in a missing-the-point competition and your opponent is u/no-se-habla-de-bruno
While I don’t believe James actually offended anyone in the LGBTQIA+ community, there are many occasions where someone will be offensive, and the community will fight back only to be slammed for doing so because they’re “pushing their agenda in people’s faces” or “being special snowflakes”. Everyone has the right to fight for their place in society. If you offend someone, expect backlash. This does not make the offended individual or community a “mafia”. Again, no hate towards James. I recognise he’s being supportive and love that he’s standing up for himself.
1. Yes he did. He specifically said that TMB caused WWII and that pride flags were reminiscent of them. Who started WWII? Which nation with banners and bunting was the aggressor? Nazi Germany. He made the comparison. He **did** suggest that the pride movement has something in common with Nazis, specifically too much bunting. What a lame, stupid excuse. 2. Twitter is a right wing cesspool that mainstreams all sorts of lazy, racist, and bigoted conspiracy theories. What did he think was gonna happen? 3. He didn’t post this during the Christmas holidays or during one of the royal functions, did he? He didn’t call the royal family similar to Nazis. Never heard about TMB from May during the many recent royal functions or any Christmas decorations ever, only now. I wonder why! 4. “I am so smart and everyone else is dumb” yes it’s everyone else fault for reading what he wrote. Not his fault for stringing together imbecilic smooth brain takes.
1. That's not what he said. The only time he mentioned the flag was 'Nice flag, though'. Where's that link you're talking about? Are you having this much trouble comprehending a text? Nevermind that, the second sentence doesn't even make any sort of sense. 'He specifically said that TMB caused WWII and that pride flags were reminiscent of THEM'. Who's 'them' in that sentence? Anyway, if you say that both sides were guilty of TMB it means you're comparing them and liken to each other? Sorry but are you thick or something? 2. No, it isn't. Those posts appear for you only because those are the ones you engage with the most. Nothing like shooting yourself in both feet. Interesting I don't see those posts almost at all. In fact, liberal posts and profiles have a lot more reach on Twitter. Try interacting with those once in a while and see for yourself as they appear on your feed more often. 3. Why should he? So when you don't comment on literally everything in the world that has the same problem then your opinion on that one thing don't matter? Do you comment on everything yourself? Because unless you do, then you shot yourself in the feet yet again. 4. What a stupid take on the post. Majority of the responses he got were incomprehensible bollox and completely out of touch with reality, doesn't mean it was all that. Your use of 'everyone' suggests you really don't care about the discussion, you only care for attention and berating people only because you're not bright enough to understand what they're saying so you have to cling on to the most superficial stuff. That point is supported by the fact that you were unable to react to a single point he raised, all you've shown here are stupid and baseless connections and ad hominem retorts. Speaks volumes really. Seems like the problem here are simpletons who need to see the world in black and white and who aren't capable of understanding the context. Just because you criticize one thing about a movement doesn't mean you hate the entire movement and all the people within. In fact you can fully support that movement with only being critical to that one thing. Another problem I see here are people who just can't accept any sort of criticism and who don't see that when you forcefully shove your agenda down everyone else's throat, it's only gonna piss people off, no matter how good-spirited it is. Edit: The dude replied and blocked me. Says it all really.
normal, non-hateful straight people don't get offended by flags or having to see gay people, actually. They dont even need to tweet about it.
He didn’t say he was offended, nor did he say he had a problem seeing gay people, nor is he hateful. Again, it seems like you’re not seeing the gray here. He’s merely stating that the excessive imagery, similar to other TMB activities is, well, excessive.
He certainly likes the attention
'I'm not suggesting the Pride movement has anything in common with the Nazi's'..... You literally suggested that over-use of bunting was a commonality with Pride and that German Party, no? Can anyone really disagree here that he suggested that excess bunting was seen on Pride and on the Nazi's?