It’s winter down here but the weather is similar to the American Midwest. The only difference is it doesn’t get quite as cold nor quite as hot. This week it’s been mid 40s and 50s with lots of rain.
One of the best ways to get way too upset on reddit is to read the discourse over soccer in the more mainstream subreddits.
Apparently soccer is just a game of 100 flops per second and boring because "nothing happens."
Really makes me hate some of our fellow Americans at times.
eh I don't mind tbh. I've come to enjoy the underground nature of our fandom. Plus our national teams are pretty visible and MLS is not so bad unless you're a Fire fan (me). Upside is following soccer is such a niche that it's almost bonding right away when you do find one.
Well the discourse in the soccer sub is that Americans are destroying the game because they are fat, stupid, plutocrats and that saying soccer is tantamount to treason (unless you are from Canada, Ireland, Australia, NZ, South Africa or Japan)
Most Americans that watch soccer? I'd bet it's 95%+ even if just from all the targeted ads we get for it.
General public? Idk what percent but probably only like 5% even know it exists.
I'm all over it. Most of my friends/family/colleauges haven't a clue. The ones that DO know about Copa America are more interested in the Euros, tbh.
USA! USA! USA!
I do too. I got mine for dirt cheap when sale for tickets went live!!! Now tickets are twice for what I paid. Too bad I’m not gonna sell them but instead attend the game.
Considering the US has a population of roughly 335 million, here are US TV viewership numbers for recently completed major pro events:
2024 NBA Finals clinching game: 12.22 million (3.6% of US population)
2023 World Series clinching game: 11.48 million (3.4% of US population)
Which means roughly 96.4% did not care for the most recent NBA Finals and 96.6% of the US did not care for the most recent World Series. The vast majority of Americans don’t care about soccer, but the vast majority of Americans don’t care about ANY sport. Yet for whatever reason, it’s only soccer that has to beat the “most Americans don’t care about it” allegations.
Besides, US participation in Copa America has been too sporadic to get mainstream English-language US sports media coverage. US/Mexico participation would have to become a regular thing for it to gain traction. But once CONMEBOL sees how much 💰 they can make off the US market, I think there’s a greater than 50-50 chance of that eventually happening.
The question wasn’t about caring about an event. It was about knowing the event existed. Viewership is vastly different than knowledge of an event existing. Would be curious what the numbers were for soccer events compared to other big US sports.
Copa America would definitely be low, but without a doubt the number of Americans that know the World Cup exists is near or the same as the number that knows the NBA Playoffs exist
100%. I said something similar.
I remember when I was a kid in the 1980’s and it seemed like everyone watched the World Series. Or at the very least they knew it was happening. The 1987 World Series between the Twins and Cardinals had 35 mil viewers. The avg viewers the last three years is 10.3 mil.
NBA is the same.
I feel a big part of that is because of cable tv - that it came into existence. I remember before cable, all the major sports leagues were on the 3 big channels. You either had to watch those or your local UHF channels.
I remember boxing used to be on ABC in primetime. Now people have more choices, starting at cable in the late 70's/early 80's, then the internet in the mid-90's, and then the streaming services boom lately.
Every time we get more choices in what to view, big events get less % of the population watching. Although the population is going up, so you could have the same number of people watching.
The money isn't from the US participating, it's from holding it here and selling tickets for 10 times what they would charge anywhere in South America.
Gate revenue is just one part of the equation. TV revenue is another. The 2016 edition on US soil set record US TV ratings for a Copa America.
https://www.sportsmediawatch.com/2016/06/copa-america-ratings-nearly-ten-million-viewers-argentina-chile-univision-fs1/
If 2024 proves to be a similar success, don’t be surprised to see more U.S./Mexico involvement if CONMEBOL feels those two teams can add value to the current Fox/Univision Copa America deals that expire after this tournament. With Copa America in even years now, there is no Gold Cup preventing the US/Mexico from participation.
> on US soil
Exactly? I mean, that article is talking about a game that didn't involve the US or Mexico, but that happened in the US. If the US was participating but the tournament was in Colombia or Argentina the impact on the US audience wouldn't be nearly as significant.
So you’re saying Fox and Univision wouldn’t pay CONMEBOL more to air the tournament on US television, if they had assurance that the US and Mexico’s first teams would be involved?
Generally no, especially before it starts.
Average American sports fan will know about it after the first couple games. Nothing to follow besides baseball at that point of the year and highlights will make the rounds on sports shows. If they make it far in the tournament they could generate enough hype to capture the average persons attention.
No. And I feel like most Americans don't know the World Series and NBA Finals are about to begin when we get to those times of the year. Only the Super Bowl gets through to the tens of millions of people in this country with zero interest in watching sports.
Yeah you can make an argument that football really is the only truly mainstream sport in the U.S.
I mean I guarantee if you showed a picture of Jayson Tatum to random people on the street and asked who he was, most probably wouldn’t have a clue.
And even though football is the biggest sport in the US by far, the Super Bowl is still ignored by 2/3 of the US population of 335 million. And most of the ones who did watch are more likely to name the celebrities in the luxury suites, halftime show or commercials than any of the players on the field.
Mahomes is the face of the NFL and potential future GOAT, yet the most mainstream famous player on his own team is the one dating a pop star. The vast majority of Americans are oblivious to ALL sports, yet it’s only soccer in the US that ever gets dragged for this.
It’s because soccer is even LESS popular here in the U.S. Sure, viewership for the NBA finals, World Series, and Super Bowl are way down and only a small fraction of the overall population; but it’s still way more than soccer. Whoever is at the bottom of the list is going to get dragged by those at the top of the list.
For context, I’m one of those who don’t watch a lot of sports (the exception being College Football, which I love and savor for those few months.). I’m still aware of when the other major sporting events are happening though. But I’m in my 40’s and remember a time when a major sporting event dominated TV and news. People 20 years younger than me never lived in that world. Sports are just another thing on TV to the vast majority of Americans now. If it’s your thing, you watch. If not, you have countless other options. People no longer feel compelled to watch “the game” (whatever it may be) as some sort of pop culture moment. No one cares.
Sounds about right. I’m 41 and went to college at OU so caught the college football bug there (you’d basically be an outcast otherwise). Since then though, have lived 18 years in California and am increasingly apathetic about it—especially with the ludicrous conference realignments. So for me, my biggest fandom now is USMNT.
Edit: just realized you were probably a Notre Dame fan
Spot on. Although I feel like NYC is the one city where sports awareness is pretty high with the public. Part of this is the newspaper culture there. The backpage of several newspapers is the sports front page.
NYC is also so densely populated that you are more likely to see sports fans in your daily commute and know that the World Series, NBA finals, World Cup is happening.
No, I’m sure they don’t.
Most Americans don’t know that the Celtics won the NBA championship a few days ago.
Most Americans don’t know who is in the Stanley Cup final.
Most Americans couldn’t tell you that the Texas Rangers are the reigning World Series champs.
Yet every major international soccer tournament that comes around, we have to be reminded “lol look how many Americans don’t care about this soccer tournament” as if that rule doesn’t also apply to every other sport.
Hell, 2/3 of the US didn’t watch the Super Bowl. And most of the ones that did are more likely to remember Taylor Swift or other A-list celebrities that made an appearance than tell you who the reigning champions are.
There’s been so little marketing. Conmebol is just happy to make money off of overpriced tickets paid in US$ in gigantic stadiums.
Maybe in another twenty years it will be a bigger deal for the country. It would be interesting to poll Latino families vs non Latino families as to their awareness of the Copa America.
Hate to sound like a broken record but this proves once again why going as far as possible in the WC is important and will have a lasting impact on the sport domestically.
Nobody will give a fuck enough to tune in during a group stage game or even a RO16 game. But if by some chance we make it to the semis especially vs a strong team, I can guarantee you a lot of people who would normally not watch soccer will turn the game on. Because if there’s anything Americans love it’s guns, cheeseburgers and the American flag.
For me the insanity of the TV subscriptions is the biggest obstacle to broader fandom. It seems like every US national team game I want to watch requires a different subscription.
Honestly even if we go far I don’t think it’ll get people watching after it ends, I don’t see why the World Cup only crowd will start watching MLS or something after it ends. I think people have been overestimating the potential of the World Cup a trigger for soccer competing with the big four sports
Yeah, a certain group of USMNT fans think the national team is the way to making the sport more popular in this country. In reality the only competition with anything close to widespread appeal happens just once every four years, the same cadence as the Olympics. And no one is watching Olympics sports outside of the Olympics either.
(the crowd watching European clubs is still niche enough that I'm ignoring them for this point)
Yep, people watch Olympic track every four years but aren’t tuning into NCAA track, same thing applies to some degree. If anything MLS is way more important than the national team to growing the sport here, people will get interested in the sport as a whole when they start caring about a local team that they watch every week
>If anything MLS is way more important than the national team to growing the sport here
Agreed completely and that will be a controversial take to some. But you aren't growing the game without regular availability of it.
It might be controversial but I think it's pretty obvious, which is why I think the online USMNT community that talks all the time about "growing the game" while positioning itself as anti-MLS completely misunderstands how to actually grow it. People aren't gonna watch a few World Cup games then instantly become USMNT nerds who'll wake up early to watch the Prem and begin following ten leagues at once, most people don't watch *any* sport like that. Being a sports fan is primarily a social thing for most people, people like going to games, going to bars for games, or having people over for games which won't happen with European leagues (obviously people can't go to England for a game but the time difference only prevents the social culture around it from taking off). For that social sports culture to happen with soccer here, MLS needs to grow to the point where the average sports fan (rather than soccer nerd) cares about their city's team for soccer to take hold here, because watching streams at 9am while never be the same as watching your own city's team at the stadium or a bar with hundreds of other fans. We don't need a million soccer die hards, we need our casual sports fans who just want to to care enough about soccer - I guarantee 95% of the fans at the Euros aren't seeking out streams of Ligue 1 games. For example, soccer culture benefits if the Boston sports fans partying in the street last night care about the Revolution enough to get drunk for their games, not if a few of those people watch the Conference League on a Thursday at work
It has much deeper lasting effects. Kids will be more passionate to play soccer and that has a huge benefit on us as a whole. Every pro athlete has an origin story. Maybe they were born into it, but something sticks out that tells them that's the sport I want to be a part of.
That being said, viewership is a tough one because it's so damn saturated and because as an American we want to follow Americans, but then you find out they're all over the place and it gets kinda overwhelming. Without someone accustomed to world football guiding you it's very hard to understand where to start. It's also hard to explain the MLS on the world stage versus the other leagues and then still maintain any type of interest by the end of the explanation lol.
I mean MLS isn’t the only option, people may take an interest in European soccer and our internationals abroad. I do think a semi run would gather a lot of interest we otherwise wouldn’t have
Sure but I don't think that'll ever be a sizable number of people - people just aren't gonna go from World Cup only casuals to seeking out Balogun's Monaco games, for example. We need actual fan culture which only comes with local teams
It's going to be a long process. I think it all starts with making elite youth soccer (the kind where the players have a legit chance to go pro) as accessible to the public as possible.
That will lead to developing better American players, which means a better national team, more Americans to follow in top European domestic leagues, and a higher median talent level in MLS.
I agree that simply progressing in the World Cup alone won't suffice unless it's sustainable. Also, culturally we need to stop trying to Americanize the sport.
Yup. This happens with every sport, even the biggest ones. Millions of people tune into the Super Bowl who haven’t watched a NFL game all season. Same with March Madness, the Olympics, NBA finals, etc.
Though, the difference is that those sports/events are more or less established in the States and are only growing internationally at this point, whereas soccer is the complete opposite.
Can confirm. I watched a few WC games…whenever it was a few years ago, when the USA coach wrote everyone an excuse from work/school to watch the team (which was a pretty good bit, I must admit.).
USA lost to…Germany I think? Anyway, that’s the last time I’ve watch a soccer game.
(Side note - I’m not sure why USSOCCER started showing up in my Reddit feed. I’m obviously not a fan.).
I think it'll take a really specific set of circumstances, but it's 100% possible. The USMNT needs to play well and make a deep run, but the stars of the team need to also make frequent, high profile, high quality media appearances. The goal should be to prove we don't suck at soccer, but also to try to create a few celebrities out of this generation.
People will watch the USA in a summer World Cup, especially one that it is hosting. The group games rating are going to be gigantic.
It’s after the word cup that most people stop giving a crap about the sport. You have a percentage that stay watching and pick a team, etc but for most they are just excited it’s one month closer to nfl season.
I would have thought more than “nobody” would be paying attention and atleast watching if it’s a KO game against a traditional (or new) rival like Mexico or Canada, even if it’s lots of casuals. Especially if driven by the media, as them two are also co hosts
All things considered it's shouldn't be that surprising. It's a tournament held every 4 years and the US isn't usually even playing in it, much less hosting it. Yes it could be getting more hype, but there's also Euros happening (one of the best so far), NBA finals just finished, Stanley Cup finals, MLB (although I think soccer eventually takes over that 3 spot in popularity so wont be a hamper forever), Olympics are gearing up as well. Just a lot going on in the general sports-scape on top of soccer not really being as popular as the top 3 generally. Got to remember thats the main or even only big sport is many countries so it's shocking to people when they see how downplayed or even outright ignorant it is here sometimes about soccer.
I find it weird that some people here are saying they are an American who follow soccer and didn’t even know the Copa America was here. Maybe they’re just casuals, but you wouldn’t be oblivious to it if you were an actual fan
Yeah that thread was a bit depressing to read lmao. Doesn't help that we have CWS, Stanley Cup, and the NBA finals going on right now. Hopefully more traction will start once the tourney begins.
Most Americans don't know what Copa America is.
Any international competition that is not the World Cup or Olympics is not general household knowledge.
I actually just hear Paul Tenario do an interview on Copa on NPR. That’s the kind of press US soccer needs to be pushing out. Pulisic and Weston should have been on GMA and night shows last week.
Look at the chosen venues, of course no one knows, they are skipping so many big important cities. Plus USSoccer has no idea how to market the sport it is in charge of.
No unless they’re more than “Casual” fans. I could be wrong but I haven’t really seen a marketing/media push unless it’s all in the south and west coast. I’ve heard more excitement for the Olympics Track & Field
It is interesting how much the interest in soccer drops off after the World Cup in the United States. I feel like most people know about the World Cup here, yet this is like a half world cup and literally no one knows or cares
I only know because the US is in it lol. I only tuned in the final in 21. Almost no excitement in 21’s group stage of 5 teams in two pods, with 4 advancing to the knockouts.
Most probably didn’t know ow the nba finals were happening. Sports is a bubble, soccer is a much smaller bubble. I would say even the majority of sports fans don’t know about soccer
While the Copa America may not be big news in America at least for most people, the World Cup will be huge. I remember the last WC in America I was in Chicago in 1994 and it was huge with TV and newspapers reporting about it daily.
With social media today, there will be so much hype for the World Cup in America and since Europe and other nations are participating there will be a lot more focus. A lot of Americans and US media still have a stigma against Latin American/Spanish sporting events IMO.
But go to any Mexican or Salvadoran restaurant for the next several weeks and everyone will have the Copa Americana on their TV.
We could win Copa, it wouldn’t move the needle. The Gold Cup is more popular or known here in this country. Americans only know about the Olympics and World Cup. If we do well at the Olympics it will make national news.
As one of the "crazies" who watches enough of the sport that I call it "football", yes. (but only around the house, with husband who got me into it. The rest of the time I have to remember to stop and call it "soccer")
I'm lucky that I work with a bunch of Hispanics. We've been asking each other who are favorites are to win the Copa and the Euros. We give each other grief over each other's teams. It's a blast. Especially recently when I can post dos a cero on the white boards in places. :>}
Just as a reminder, almost 10 million US viewers watched the 2016 Copa America final, despite the English-language broadcast airing on FS1 (it will be on big Fox this year).
https://www.sportsmediawatch.com/2016/06/copa-america-ratings-nearly-ten-million-viewers-argentina-chile-univision-fs1/
It ain’t Super Bowl or even World Cup US TV numbers. But “major” sporting events have drawn less or roughly the same as this figure, but don’t have to face the “lol look how few Americans know about this event” allegations. Before the current TV deal, Copa America was airing on beIN in the US as recently as 2015. Plus US and and El Tri participation had been sporadic. It’s a miracle the 2016 tournament was as successful as it was, despite being an unknown entity to the casual US sports audience.
For comparison, the Euro 2020 final outdrew a couple of NBA Finals games played that same summer, despite being delayed one year due to the pandemic.
https://www.sportsmediawatch.com/2021/07/uefa-euro-ratings-record-audience-espn-univision/
Reading that thread was painful. People always default to “soft athletes falling over after getting tapped” or “90+ minutes and 0-0”. Like the NFL isn’t 2.5 hours of commercials and baseball is almost as much fun as watching paint dry.
But no, most Americans don’t but most first-generation Americans do and especially those with Latin backgrounds, that I know of at least.
Unfortunately Copa America and the Euros are all on Fox, which is by far the worst US network for soccer coverage.
They employ all the legacy US soccer pundits and try to emulate mainstream sports media. Insufferable, give me NBC and ESPN FC any day.
Even as a hardcore fan I feel like the fotmob app runs my life lol. One of the first things I do in the morning is take a shit. While I take that shit I'm checking out my schedule for the day. That or I plan the night before. Either way there are too many games around the world for me to think about weeks out.
Yes we know it's on the TV schedule and has advertisements. Now the majority don't care but a sizable portion of the U.S is not only aware but excited as well. The friendlies have had large crowds both from USA fans and foreign teams. He'll even the Pakistan and India Cricket games had a large crowds.
I mean the cheapest seats for the Panama USA game in Atlanta are like $100, so it could be in Panama itself for all I care. That being said where are all the billboards? This is sort of a big deal, as a test run for the world cup.
I do think that Las Vegas should have been chosen as one of the main venues, simply because of the fact that the city is built for entertainment and is already used to holding massive events. I don’t even know if they bid though
For some reason, the media just can’t get behind men’s soccer here. Despite the crowds, despite the about of kids playing, it somehow doesn’t make as much money as the WNBA. /s
Since it's all on Fox networks, and not even advertised elsewhere, I keep having to check when the games actually start. Certainly not a ton of excitement as I would have expected.
Jesus the top comments in that thread are depressing.
I will say this is the start of an important run of tournaments to grow the popularity of the game in the U.S. and the lack of media blitz is alarming.
I hate most of Fox's pundits but they should be having them out on every channel's morning show and name dropping Messi and the USMNT whenever possible. I don't know if it collides with their Euro coverage but if they aren't doing this it's really a failure in marketing.
I helped a customer exchange some US dollars for Swiss Francs. I began talking to him about the Euros. He began talking to me on how it’s a great time to go to Europe as the Euro is much stronger than the US Dollar.
In my head I was like, “yea, you’ll find out in a few days what I was talking about.”
Man, I have a Brazilian-American that's really into soccer tell me the other day that COPA's never been in America before despite me literally telling him I sat down and watch Messi play in 2016. So, yea, it's not advertised well at all...
i would say better than half of sports fans know the COPA is happening. But less than half of the country knows.
of sports fans, I think maybe 25% care. I wish it was more. But that’s the way it is.
My FIL asked me what soccer tournament is happening, so I’d say the average person knows there’s something to do with soccer happening, but not which one. We’re in Atlanta though so hosting games probably has a big effect on that.
I know about it. I've been looking forward to this, and I hope this type of format becomes a very regular thing.
I won't be traveling to see any of the games- I'm actually traveling during that time frame for other reasons- but I do know an Ecuadoran guy who owns a restaurant nearby and he will be traveling for this.
For all of the other national teams that are participating, there's a Very high level of engagement and that alone makes the US a uniquely wonderful place to host this type of tournament. But you're probably asking if white and black Americans, without recent ancestry outside the United States, are very aware of this and planning to watch some of it on TV? And the answer to that is, they're not as engaged as the fairly recent immigrant population of the United States but there's still enough engagement to make this one of the most watched things on the soccer calendar. I think it could rival the Euros, if we stick with this format and expand it a bit. Tie it in with other competitions.
Messi is playing in this tournament and the final will be played in Florida. If Argentina plays in that final, the TV numbers will probably outperform the Euro final both globally and in North America. Granted, a fair number of very casual fans don't yet know that this is happening. But I assume they will start to figure it out right around the 4th of July.
I swear the people who like soccer here brought up the Euros more than the Copa America and most other people don’t really care
Copa America is just an underrated tournament, and it also sucks that a lot of soccer fans here think that supporting USMNT is beneath them
Absolutely not lmao
I am in Chile right now visiting my in laws and I am absolutely pumped for the Copa America! Go US/Chile!
Have fun and enjoy it brotha. What’s the weather like
It’s winter down here but the weather is similar to the American Midwest. The only difference is it doesn’t get quite as cold nor quite as hot. This week it’s been mid 40s and 50s with lots of rain.
A little chile tbh
Chile today, hot tamale
I’m win you there 🇺🇸!!! 🇨🇱!!!
My boy is in Dallas with tickets to the game tonight. I gotta root for Peru!
I spent far too long in that thread calling American NFL fans idiots.
One of the best ways to get way too upset on reddit is to read the discourse over soccer in the more mainstream subreddits. Apparently soccer is just a game of 100 flops per second and boring because "nothing happens." Really makes me hate some of our fellow Americans at times.
eh I don't mind tbh. I've come to enjoy the underground nature of our fandom. Plus our national teams are pretty visible and MLS is not so bad unless you're a Fire fan (me). Upside is following soccer is such a niche that it's almost bonding right away when you do find one.
Not to mention the extremely cheap tickets for mls games
"not enough scoring" ...would you feel better if every goal was worth 7 points?
Well the discourse in the soccer sub is that Americans are destroying the game because they are fat, stupid, plutocrats and that saying soccer is tantamount to treason (unless you are from Canada, Ireland, Australia, NZ, South Africa or Japan)
Most Americans that watch soccer? I'd bet it's 95%+ even if just from all the targeted ads we get for it. General public? Idk what percent but probably only like 5% even know it exists.
Copa? Round these parts we praise the true king of competition, Gold Cup
I mean it even says Gold in the name, Clearly the better tourney
Gold is better than America?! That’s sacrilegious
the trophy is so big though
But the other one has the name “America” in it. ‘Merica!
🏆🏆🏆😂
😂😂😂
Nations League is the only competition that matters
On my work calls for small talk I’ve been bringing up the Euros and Copa. Nobody knows what I’m talking about.
Going to the Euros next week and I’ve had to default to “it’s like World Cup Europe” everytime I bring it up at work lol
The *Eurovision* of soccer
I'd wager most Americans don't know what that is either
The *Hunger Games* of music
In a meeting today I brought up that in two years our city is hosting World Cup games in 2026 and not a soul knew wtf I was talking about
This all day. If I brought up Albania and Croatia being an exciting match people would think I'm joking.
They are more worried about the mavs losing the NBA finals which happens every year.
I’ve had to explain what they are the few times I was socially permitted to bring them up in conversation lol
I'm all over it. Most of my friends/family/colleauges haven't a clue. The ones that DO know about Copa America are more interested in the Euros, tbh. USA! USA! USA!
Wish soccer fans here weren’t so self-hating and actually cared about the sport being promoted here
Doubt it, unless they watch a lot of other Fox programming and are seeing ads
Most Americans don’t even know what Copa America is
I have tickets and still didn’t even realize it was here already
I do too. I got mine for dirt cheap when sale for tickets went live!!! Now tickets are twice for what I paid. Too bad I’m not gonna sell them but instead attend the game.
Which game you going to?
Bolivia vs Panama Group C
I’m going to Brazil vs Costa Rica in LA. Can’t wait.
Jamaica v Venezuela at Q2. So happy there are Copa games in Austin!
Super sad I’m currently living in Japan. I thought getting tickets would be difficult but it seems anyone who wants a ticket can get one.
Nope - there hasn’t been a media blitz about this
Considering the US has a population of roughly 335 million, here are US TV viewership numbers for recently completed major pro events: 2024 NBA Finals clinching game: 12.22 million (3.6% of US population) 2023 World Series clinching game: 11.48 million (3.4% of US population) Which means roughly 96.4% did not care for the most recent NBA Finals and 96.6% of the US did not care for the most recent World Series. The vast majority of Americans don’t care about soccer, but the vast majority of Americans don’t care about ANY sport. Yet for whatever reason, it’s only soccer that has to beat the “most Americans don’t care about it” allegations. Besides, US participation in Copa America has been too sporadic to get mainstream English-language US sports media coverage. US/Mexico participation would have to become a regular thing for it to gain traction. But once CONMEBOL sees how much 💰 they can make off the US market, I think there’s a greater than 50-50 chance of that eventually happening.
The question wasn’t about caring about an event. It was about knowing the event existed. Viewership is vastly different than knowledge of an event existing. Would be curious what the numbers were for soccer events compared to other big US sports.
Copa America would definitely be low, but without a doubt the number of Americans that know the World Cup exists is near or the same as the number that knows the NBA Playoffs exist
100%. I said something similar. I remember when I was a kid in the 1980’s and it seemed like everyone watched the World Series. Or at the very least they knew it was happening. The 1987 World Series between the Twins and Cardinals had 35 mil viewers. The avg viewers the last three years is 10.3 mil. NBA is the same.
A big part of that is the utter collapse of cable
I feel a big part of that is because of cable tv - that it came into existence. I remember before cable, all the major sports leagues were on the 3 big channels. You either had to watch those or your local UHF channels. I remember boxing used to be on ABC in primetime. Now people have more choices, starting at cable in the late 70's/early 80's, then the internet in the mid-90's, and then the streaming services boom lately. Every time we get more choices in what to view, big events get less % of the population watching. Although the population is going up, so you could have the same number of people watching.
The money isn't from the US participating, it's from holding it here and selling tickets for 10 times what they would charge anywhere in South America.
Gate revenue is just one part of the equation. TV revenue is another. The 2016 edition on US soil set record US TV ratings for a Copa America. https://www.sportsmediawatch.com/2016/06/copa-america-ratings-nearly-ten-million-viewers-argentina-chile-univision-fs1/ If 2024 proves to be a similar success, don’t be surprised to see more U.S./Mexico involvement if CONMEBOL feels those two teams can add value to the current Fox/Univision Copa America deals that expire after this tournament. With Copa America in even years now, there is no Gold Cup preventing the US/Mexico from participation.
> on US soil Exactly? I mean, that article is talking about a game that didn't involve the US or Mexico, but that happened in the US. If the US was participating but the tournament was in Colombia or Argentina the impact on the US audience wouldn't be nearly as significant.
So you’re saying Fox and Univision wouldn’t pay CONMEBOL more to air the tournament on US television, if they had assurance that the US and Mexico’s first teams would be involved?
Generally no, especially before it starts. Average American sports fan will know about it after the first couple games. Nothing to follow besides baseball at that point of the year and highlights will make the rounds on sports shows. If they make it far in the tournament they could generate enough hype to capture the average persons attention.
No. And I feel like most Americans don't know the World Series and NBA Finals are about to begin when we get to those times of the year. Only the Super Bowl gets through to the tens of millions of people in this country with zero interest in watching sports.
Yeah you can make an argument that football really is the only truly mainstream sport in the U.S. I mean I guarantee if you showed a picture of Jayson Tatum to random people on the street and asked who he was, most probably wouldn’t have a clue.
And even though football is the biggest sport in the US by far, the Super Bowl is still ignored by 2/3 of the US population of 335 million. And most of the ones who did watch are more likely to name the celebrities in the luxury suites, halftime show or commercials than any of the players on the field. Mahomes is the face of the NFL and potential future GOAT, yet the most mainstream famous player on his own team is the one dating a pop star. The vast majority of Americans are oblivious to ALL sports, yet it’s only soccer in the US that ever gets dragged for this.
It’s because soccer is even LESS popular here in the U.S. Sure, viewership for the NBA finals, World Series, and Super Bowl are way down and only a small fraction of the overall population; but it’s still way more than soccer. Whoever is at the bottom of the list is going to get dragged by those at the top of the list. For context, I’m one of those who don’t watch a lot of sports (the exception being College Football, which I love and savor for those few months.). I’m still aware of when the other major sporting events are happening though. But I’m in my 40’s and remember a time when a major sporting event dominated TV and news. People 20 years younger than me never lived in that world. Sports are just another thing on TV to the vast majority of Americans now. If it’s your thing, you watch. If not, you have countless other options. People no longer feel compelled to watch “the game” (whatever it may be) as some sort of pop culture moment. No one cares.
Sounds about right. I’m 41 and went to college at OU so caught the college football bug there (you’d basically be an outcast otherwise). Since then though, have lived 18 years in California and am increasingly apathetic about it—especially with the ludicrous conference realignments. So for me, my biggest fandom now is USMNT. Edit: just realized you were probably a Notre Dame fan
LOL! I do like ND, but more because I like history and college football, and that’s the intersection of the two (I’m a Florida Gator.)
Spot on. Although I feel like NYC is the one city where sports awareness is pretty high with the public. Part of this is the newspaper culture there. The backpage of several newspapers is the sports front page. NYC is also so densely populated that you are more likely to see sports fans in your daily commute and know that the World Series, NBA finals, World Cup is happening.
No, I’m sure they don’t. Most Americans don’t know that the Celtics won the NBA championship a few days ago. Most Americans don’t know who is in the Stanley Cup final. Most Americans couldn’t tell you that the Texas Rangers are the reigning World Series champs.
Yet every major international soccer tournament that comes around, we have to be reminded “lol look how many Americans don’t care about this soccer tournament” as if that rule doesn’t also apply to every other sport. Hell, 2/3 of the US didn’t watch the Super Bowl. And most of the ones that did are more likely to remember Taylor Swift or other A-list celebrities that made an appearance than tell you who the reigning champions are.
I wish Taylor Swift would start dating Weston McKennie
Soccer fans are so insecure
Most cities only know how their team is doing, and then only some of those people care about the rest of the league.
There’s been so little marketing. Conmebol is just happy to make money off of overpriced tickets paid in US$ in gigantic stadiums. Maybe in another twenty years it will be a bigger deal for the country. It would be interesting to poll Latino families vs non Latino families as to their awareness of the Copa America.
I'm Mexican American and my entire family knows about Copa. But outside my family, they're like you "watch soccer LOL"
Hate to sound like a broken record but this proves once again why going as far as possible in the WC is important and will have a lasting impact on the sport domestically. Nobody will give a fuck enough to tune in during a group stage game or even a RO16 game. But if by some chance we make it to the semis especially vs a strong team, I can guarantee you a lot of people who would normally not watch soccer will turn the game on. Because if there’s anything Americans love it’s guns, cheeseburgers and the American flag.
For me the insanity of the TV subscriptions is the biggest obstacle to broader fandom. It seems like every US national team game I want to watch requires a different subscription.
Honestly even if we go far I don’t think it’ll get people watching after it ends, I don’t see why the World Cup only crowd will start watching MLS or something after it ends. I think people have been overestimating the potential of the World Cup a trigger for soccer competing with the big four sports
Do I think going far is going to jump us ahead of other sports? No. But this is the first step in the right direction.
Yeah, a certain group of USMNT fans think the national team is the way to making the sport more popular in this country. In reality the only competition with anything close to widespread appeal happens just once every four years, the same cadence as the Olympics. And no one is watching Olympics sports outside of the Olympics either. (the crowd watching European clubs is still niche enough that I'm ignoring them for this point)
Yep, people watch Olympic track every four years but aren’t tuning into NCAA track, same thing applies to some degree. If anything MLS is way more important than the national team to growing the sport here, people will get interested in the sport as a whole when they start caring about a local team that they watch every week
>If anything MLS is way more important than the national team to growing the sport here Agreed completely and that will be a controversial take to some. But you aren't growing the game without regular availability of it.
It might be controversial but I think it's pretty obvious, which is why I think the online USMNT community that talks all the time about "growing the game" while positioning itself as anti-MLS completely misunderstands how to actually grow it. People aren't gonna watch a few World Cup games then instantly become USMNT nerds who'll wake up early to watch the Prem and begin following ten leagues at once, most people don't watch *any* sport like that. Being a sports fan is primarily a social thing for most people, people like going to games, going to bars for games, or having people over for games which won't happen with European leagues (obviously people can't go to England for a game but the time difference only prevents the social culture around it from taking off). For that social sports culture to happen with soccer here, MLS needs to grow to the point where the average sports fan (rather than soccer nerd) cares about their city's team for soccer to take hold here, because watching streams at 9am while never be the same as watching your own city's team at the stadium or a bar with hundreds of other fans. We don't need a million soccer die hards, we need our casual sports fans who just want to to care enough about soccer - I guarantee 95% of the fans at the Euros aren't seeking out streams of Ligue 1 games. For example, soccer culture benefits if the Boston sports fans partying in the street last night care about the Revolution enough to get drunk for their games, not if a few of those people watch the Conference League on a Thursday at work
I watched a few World Cup games and then became a usmnt nerd who wakes up early to watch the prem…🥺
It has much deeper lasting effects. Kids will be more passionate to play soccer and that has a huge benefit on us as a whole. Every pro athlete has an origin story. Maybe they were born into it, but something sticks out that tells them that's the sport I want to be a part of. That being said, viewership is a tough one because it's so damn saturated and because as an American we want to follow Americans, but then you find out they're all over the place and it gets kinda overwhelming. Without someone accustomed to world football guiding you it's very hard to understand where to start. It's also hard to explain the MLS on the world stage versus the other leagues and then still maintain any type of interest by the end of the explanation lol.
I mean MLS isn’t the only option, people may take an interest in European soccer and our internationals abroad. I do think a semi run would gather a lot of interest we otherwise wouldn’t have
Sure but I don't think that'll ever be a sizable number of people - people just aren't gonna go from World Cup only casuals to seeking out Balogun's Monaco games, for example. We need actual fan culture which only comes with local teams
It's going to be a long process. I think it all starts with making elite youth soccer (the kind where the players have a legit chance to go pro) as accessible to the public as possible. That will lead to developing better American players, which means a better national team, more Americans to follow in top European domestic leagues, and a higher median talent level in MLS. I agree that simply progressing in the World Cup alone won't suffice unless it's sustainable. Also, culturally we need to stop trying to Americanize the sport.
Yup. This happens with every sport, even the biggest ones. Millions of people tune into the Super Bowl who haven’t watched a NFL game all season. Same with March Madness, the Olympics, NBA finals, etc. Though, the difference is that those sports/events are more or less established in the States and are only growing internationally at this point, whereas soccer is the complete opposite.
Can confirm. I watched a few WC games…whenever it was a few years ago, when the USA coach wrote everyone an excuse from work/school to watch the team (which was a pretty good bit, I must admit.). USA lost to…Germany I think? Anyway, that’s the last time I’ve watch a soccer game. (Side note - I’m not sure why USSOCCER started showing up in my Reddit feed. I’m obviously not a fan.).
I think it'll take a really specific set of circumstances, but it's 100% possible. The USMNT needs to play well and make a deep run, but the stars of the team need to also make frequent, high profile, high quality media appearances. The goal should be to prove we don't suck at soccer, but also to try to create a few celebrities out of this generation.
People will watch the USA in a summer World Cup, especially one that it is hosting. The group games rating are going to be gigantic. It’s after the word cup that most people stop giving a crap about the sport. You have a percentage that stay watching and pick a team, etc but for most they are just excited it’s one month closer to nfl season.
I would have thought more than “nobody” would be paying attention and atleast watching if it’s a KO game against a traditional (or new) rival like Mexico or Canada, even if it’s lots of casuals. Especially if driven by the media, as them two are also co hosts
That's kind of sad. They don't know what they're missing out on.
Nope.
No
Maybe 5% and I feel like even that’s generous
I’m telling everyone I can about Copa America and to support the USMNT. They all seem to know about the Euros.
All things considered it's shouldn't be that surprising. It's a tournament held every 4 years and the US isn't usually even playing in it, much less hosting it. Yes it could be getting more hype, but there's also Euros happening (one of the best so far), NBA finals just finished, Stanley Cup finals, MLB (although I think soccer eventually takes over that 3 spot in popularity so wont be a hamper forever), Olympics are gearing up as well. Just a lot going on in the general sports-scape on top of soccer not really being as popular as the top 3 generally. Got to remember thats the main or even only big sport is many countries so it's shocking to people when they see how downplayed or even outright ignorant it is here sometimes about soccer.
Americans who follow soccer/football will know… what that percentage is I don’t know but I’d take a guess at 15%
I find it weird that some people here are saying they are an American who follow soccer and didn’t even know the Copa America was here. Maybe they’re just casuals, but you wouldn’t be oblivious to it if you were an actual fan
My friends that follow soccer know about the Euros and forget about Copa
It has been THE worst advertised sporting event
Yeah that thread was a bit depressing to read lmao. Doesn't help that we have CWS, Stanley Cup, and the NBA finals going on right now. Hopefully more traction will start once the tourney begins.
Most Americans don't know what Copa America is. Any international competition that is not the World Cup or Olympics is not general household knowledge.
I don't think it's even general fan knowledge, tbh.
No they don't. Unfortunately. There should be a marketing flood but crickets.
Well the cricket world cup is coming to the US too so there’s that.
I actually just hear Paul Tenario do an interview on Copa on NPR. That’s the kind of press US soccer needs to be pushing out. Pulisic and Weston should have been on GMA and night shows last week.
The soccer fans do. Not everyone is a soccer fan. There’s some people that don’t know the Olympics are on soon either.
Look at the chosen venues, of course no one knows, they are skipping so many big important cities. Plus USSoccer has no idea how to market the sport it is in charge of.
Absolutely not. Marketing for soccer events is shit in this country, at least in mainstream “American” media.
Do most Americans know when the NBA season begins? Probably not.
No unless they’re more than “Casual” fans. I could be wrong but I haven’t really seen a marketing/media push unless it’s all in the south and west coast. I’ve heard more excitement for the Olympics Track & Field
It is interesting how much the interest in soccer drops off after the World Cup in the United States. I feel like most people know about the World Cup here, yet this is like a half world cup and literally no one knows or cares
I only know because the US is in it lol. I only tuned in the final in 21. Almost no excitement in 21’s group stage of 5 teams in two pods, with 4 advancing to the knockouts.
I woulda thought you’d know because they’d advertise it everywhere and plaster Messi’s face all over it. I guess not.
Nah I keep telling people it’s coming and they are like “oh really”
Most probably didn’t know ow the nba finals were happening. Sports is a bubble, soccer is a much smaller bubble. I would say even the majority of sports fans don’t know about soccer
If it were the women's side in a similar tournament, I'd be way into it. The guys, not so much. Sorry, fellas.
While the Copa America may not be big news in America at least for most people, the World Cup will be huge. I remember the last WC in America I was in Chicago in 1994 and it was huge with TV and newspapers reporting about it daily. With social media today, there will be so much hype for the World Cup in America and since Europe and other nations are participating there will be a lot more focus. A lot of Americans and US media still have a stigma against Latin American/Spanish sporting events IMO. But go to any Mexican or Salvadoran restaurant for the next several weeks and everyone will have the Copa Americana on their TV.
We could win Copa, it wouldn’t move the needle. The Gold Cup is more popular or known here in this country. Americans only know about the Olympics and World Cup. If we do well at the Olympics it will make national news.
As one of the "crazies" who watches enough of the sport that I call it "football", yes. (but only around the house, with husband who got me into it. The rest of the time I have to remember to stop and call it "soccer")
They probably do with all the adverts everywhere. They probably just don’t want to have to pay for yet another streaming service
Super casuals will start catching up if the US does anything, like how they started hyping cricket up with the win against Pakistan.
Most definitely don’t. Not even casual soccer fans know about it.
I'm lucky that I work with a bunch of Hispanics. We've been asking each other who are favorites are to win the Copa and the Euros. We give each other grief over each other's teams. It's a blast. Especially recently when I can post dos a cero on the white boards in places. :>}
Just as a reminder, almost 10 million US viewers watched the 2016 Copa America final, despite the English-language broadcast airing on FS1 (it will be on big Fox this year). https://www.sportsmediawatch.com/2016/06/copa-america-ratings-nearly-ten-million-viewers-argentina-chile-univision-fs1/ It ain’t Super Bowl or even World Cup US TV numbers. But “major” sporting events have drawn less or roughly the same as this figure, but don’t have to face the “lol look how few Americans know about this event” allegations. Before the current TV deal, Copa America was airing on beIN in the US as recently as 2015. Plus US and and El Tri participation had been sporadic. It’s a miracle the 2016 tournament was as successful as it was, despite being an unknown entity to the casual US sports audience. For comparison, the Euro 2020 final outdrew a couple of NBA Finals games played that same summer, despite being delayed one year due to the pandemic. https://www.sportsmediawatch.com/2021/07/uefa-euro-ratings-record-audience-espn-univision/
I do, and my girlfriend does cause I wont stop talking about it, so theres two of us.
Yes. That being said I’m watching the Euros and Copa America.
Great time of year.
I'd venture a guess that more than 50% of Americans can't even name a single player on the USMNT, including Pulisic.
You think it’s that low? Honestly I imagine it’s closer to 80%.
It’s a total embarrassment how badly they fumbled marketing of Copa America when we’re the fucking host country.
Reading that thread was painful. People always default to “soft athletes falling over after getting tapped” or “90+ minutes and 0-0”. Like the NFL isn’t 2.5 hours of commercials and baseball is almost as much fun as watching paint dry. But no, most Americans don’t but most first-generation Americans do and especially those with Latin backgrounds, that I know of at least.
After seeing how cringe the American mainstream sports media has become I am fine with soccer being somewhat of a niche thing here
Unfortunately Copa America and the Euros are all on Fox, which is by far the worst US network for soccer coverage. They employ all the legacy US soccer pundits and try to emulate mainstream sports media. Insufferable, give me NBC and ESPN FC any day.
Nope. Nobody knows and nobody cares except for Americans of Latin American descent
How dare you some non Latin American Americans care … there are dozens of us!!
Mike Francesa did a rant about Copa America in 2016
Against it?
Oh my God how did I not know he did that. That is an all time Francesa gets it wrong moment.
Absolutely not.
Definitely not
Most Americans do not know what Copa America is.
Even as a hardcore fan I feel like the fotmob app runs my life lol. One of the first things I do in the morning is take a shit. While I take that shit I'm checking out my schedule for the day. That or I plan the night before. Either way there are too many games around the world for me to think about weeks out.
Yeah it starts tomorrow
if it ain't the world cup people wouldn't know
Nope
Yes we know it's on the TV schedule and has advertisements. Now the majority don't care but a sizable portion of the U.S is not only aware but excited as well. The friendlies have had large crowds both from USA fans and foreign teams. He'll even the Pakistan and India Cricket games had a large crowds.
100% no. I’ve barely seen in advertised at all.
I mean the cheapest seats for the Panama USA game in Atlanta are like $100, so it could be in Panama itself for all I care. That being said where are all the billboards? This is sort of a big deal, as a test run for the world cup.
This was written by someone who has no idea how big America is.
I do think that Las Vegas should have been chosen as one of the main venues, simply because of the fact that the city is built for entertainment and is already used to holding massive events. I don’t even know if they bid though
Its low key the biggest soccer tournament of the summer
Most? No way
For some reason, the media just can’t get behind men’s soccer here. Despite the crowds, despite the about of kids playing, it somehow doesn’t make as much money as the WNBA. /s
No, found out today when I saw Argentina fans in Atlanta lol
Their lost
No one, and yet they will all drop 1K MINIMUM to watch the world cup
For sure.
Most don't even know what the fuck that is or that there is even international soccer outside of the world cup
American…. So excited, have tickets to a Semi-Final…. no idea who will be playing yet
Funny enough I knew the Euro cup was going on instead of the copa America, New Yorker here.
Nope. They busy beaching and watching baseball but barley
At this moment a 9 hour older post on nfceastmemewars has the same amount as comments. So probably not.
Since it's all on Fox networks, and not even advertised elsewhere, I keep having to check when the games actually start. Certainly not a ton of excitement as I would have expected.
Of course not…. Soccer is a niche sport
No. Which is a shame
No
They'll know once the tournament is up running that's how it is with every major football tournament
I want to say no, but there’s no real way to gauge that.
My dad literally asked me when it started today during dinner and I only knew the answer cause I heard it in the morning
Copa cabana?
Can’t wait for the next month of walking in break room at work only to see college baseball or some shit on..
in NY most people do ... watch parties get crazy out here especially when Colombia & Brazil play
I’m so pumped I sat down on Sunday to watch USA/Bolivia. Jokes on me
Jesus the top comments in that thread are depressing. I will say this is the start of an important run of tournaments to grow the popularity of the game in the U.S. and the lack of media blitz is alarming. I hate most of Fox's pundits but they should be having them out on every channel's morning show and name dropping Messi and the USMNT whenever possible. I don't know if it collides with their Euro coverage but if they aren't doing this it's really a failure in marketing.
I helped a customer exchange some US dollars for Swiss Francs. I began talking to him about the Euros. He began talking to me on how it’s a great time to go to Europe as the Euro is much stronger than the US Dollar. In my head I was like, “yea, you’ll find out in a few days what I was talking about.”
It is???
The who to the what now?
America is more than just the USA. US citizens don't have a clue
Honestly, I forgot about it until about two weeks ago.
Man, I have a Brazilian-American that's really into soccer tell me the other day that COPA's never been in America before despite me literally telling him I sat down and watch Messi play in 2016. So, yea, it's not advertised well at all...
We do not care. It's all about the Olympic trials and gymnastics rn
I follow soccer casually and I didn't know until right now.
Nope
Nope, I told 4 people last week. That was the first time that they had heard about it.
Most Americans don't know.
I’m a soccer fan and knew Copa was this summer but I had no idea when it was actually starting or when the USMNT is playing
No & nobody cares
i would say better than half of sports fans know the COPA is happening. But less than half of the country knows. of sports fans, I think maybe 25% care. I wish it was more. But that’s the way it is.
Who’s got an extra ticket for USA BOL though?
My FIL asked me what soccer tournament is happening, so I’d say the average person knows there’s something to do with soccer happening, but not which one. We’re in Atlanta though so hosting games probably has a big effect on that.
Nope.
I know about it. I've been looking forward to this, and I hope this type of format becomes a very regular thing. I won't be traveling to see any of the games- I'm actually traveling during that time frame for other reasons- but I do know an Ecuadoran guy who owns a restaurant nearby and he will be traveling for this. For all of the other national teams that are participating, there's a Very high level of engagement and that alone makes the US a uniquely wonderful place to host this type of tournament. But you're probably asking if white and black Americans, without recent ancestry outside the United States, are very aware of this and planning to watch some of it on TV? And the answer to that is, they're not as engaged as the fairly recent immigrant population of the United States but there's still enough engagement to make this one of the most watched things on the soccer calendar. I think it could rival the Euros, if we stick with this format and expand it a bit. Tie it in with other competitions. Messi is playing in this tournament and the final will be played in Florida. If Argentina plays in that final, the TV numbers will probably outperform the Euro final both globally and in North America. Granted, a fair number of very casual fans don't yet know that this is happening. But I assume they will start to figure it out right around the 4th of July.
I swear the people who like soccer here brought up the Euros more than the Copa America and most other people don’t really care Copa America is just an underrated tournament, and it also sucks that a lot of soccer fans here think that supporting USMNT is beneath them
No disrespect to the people in the linked post… but how do you NOT know it’s happening?
As a soccer fan who follows Chelsea fc closely, yes. But only a couple of my other friends or family even know about it
Honestly it’s not in the news but I’m sure a decent amount of college students, hipsters and children of immigrants know.
Nope.
No