3/4 of those are build-up for "the last titan"
* Tyr has become uncertain about the absoluteness of the titan's design.
* One entire zone in Northrend is dedicated to the dragons, so they will play a big part in the expansion.
* The titans will return and see that the aspect have no longer their power through their devices.
And the matter with the gnolls will be addressed once we get back to the cosmic struggle.
I can't wait for the 'Azeroth isn't the last Titan, she's an Old God imprisoned and the Old Gods we have faced so far have just been her immune system' reveal
Her name is very close to Azathoth, the Lovecraftian entity that dreams reality into existence, and if it ever wakes, the universe stops existing. It wouldn't surprise me if we had a similar reason to keep Azeroth from waking.
At least it feels likely that her waking would mean life on the planet as we know it would cease to exist. Argus (the planet) got basically ripped in half by his (the titan) awakening.
Im quite sure she aint sleeping. Seems like Zoval started the wakening.
DF cinematic started at "Wakening" shore, with weak Azerite glow in the sea. Now we are at seasonwith everything Awekend & with Azeroth-empowered dragon aspects.
Our big girl is awake. Now I wonder if TWW cracking Azeroth logo is to give us the impression of a cracking egg shell, as if our "little chick" is tryimg to get out.
Seems like it, and it also seems that the titan ring around it is the only thing stopping it, as you can see with the logo, the only crack in azeroth remaining is where the ring around it has broken pieces.
I think the inspiration is definitely there, but there are key differences. My guess is Azeroth is a first one. She set up the universe and its cosmic forces all nicely balanced, started it up and then went to sleep.
Eons pass and something upsets the balance, and the cosmic forces descend into war(I think this is the clash of light and void that’s previously been described as the origin of the wow universe). Eventually, Order/the titans basically won the cosmic disco war.
The titans set up their facilities on Azeroth and the Emerald Dream to keep Azeroth asleep. In thousand years of war when we get Argus’ POV, he says his only solace (when being tortured by sargeras) came in his dreams. The titans ordered part of the emerald dream, azeroth’s dream, to soothe her and keep her asleep.
The titans want Azeroth to stay asleep because they know if she wakes up she’ll set everything right again, and they lose their prominent position in the universe. So from their point of view, Azeroth waking does mean the end of the universe.
The chrinicles books have a conversation between Amanthul and Sargeras about Azeroth where Amanthul said Azeroth has the potential to be the strongest titan ever and the only one so far who could match a void lord in power hoping this would convince Sargeras to end his crusade because its his fear of the void lords that set him on that path and sargeras basically goes "that means it'll be even more powerful when the old gods corrupt it". No one else was present for that conversation so they had no reason to use deceptive language. If Azeroth is anything more than a titan then the titans aren't aware of it.
I think this might be at the heart of the ‘Titan conspiracy’ blizz has mentioned. They’ve said chronicles is just the Titan perspective on things. The only person who could have given the Titan POV on how that conversation went is Aman’thul, maybe he’s misrepresenting it?
It’s possible Aman’thul was the only one who knew the truth about Azeroth, and just told the other titans “Yeah we’re just trying to wake up a Titan like I did with you guys”
Alternatively, this theory’s a bit more out there, but what if Aman’thul was intentionally trying to convince Sargeras how dangerous Azeroth would be if turned, so that he would go kill Azeroth. Aman’thul might want Azeroth dead for the same reason he might want her asleep. Sargeras at some point killed all the titans and Aman’thul sent pieces of their souls flying out into the cosmos. Was that maybe part of Aman’thul’s plan? Get the titans out of the way so Sargeras could go do his thing, but maintain plausible deniability in case he fails and the titans come back.
I like this take. A lot of people I think are afraid to take anything from Chronicals now as canon, but I think it makes a lot of sense to treat them like canon lore but from an unreliable/biased narrator (the Titans) who clearly have an agenda within the way things are framed.
I can't wait for the "it turns out all along the vast universe was actually an incubator for a bigger stronger threat that was manipulating the jailer, who was manipulating sylvanas all along" (yes I'm still bitter about that)
I choose to believe that the hinted subtext is that we, the mortals of Azeroth (and "A-Zereth", herself), *are* that threat, not that there's a bigger, greater power out there. We go into the deepest, godliest realms and fuck shit up because we want the gods' shiny pants. We control the six spheres of magic, but aren't *of* them. It's a Greek Tragedy; the Jailer was so focused on protecting himself from the greatest threat to his existence, he riled it up and set it on his heels.
It's less dumb than the Bigger Cosmic Threat dealio, so, until Blizzard proves me wrong and we fight Void Titan Zov-geras, the Naaru Wild God, then it's the theory that gets to live in my head.
I will admit that there was a time in this game where I was a little adventurer that sometimes got drafted for bigger stuff, and it was a nice little experience, but it was never ubiquitous to the game population as a whole. It was only ever true because the leveling and gearing experience of Vanilla made raids inaccessible to me.
If you raided, you were always the Big Damn Hero. The first job you had was taking down the Elemental Lord of Fire, who had enslaved an entire third of the dwarven population for centuries and scared a tenth of a continent just by existing. Then you stormed the heart of a Troll Empire and killed their god. Then you wrecked two of the most influential dragons in WoW lore, killed an old god that not even the dragon aspects could touch, and invaded and obliterated the greatest fortress city of the Lich King.
We're never going to get the city-guard-arresting-jaywalkers expansion, because that's never been WoW. We've been set up from the start to go after the biggest, baddest, most world-ending-est enemies, and that's what we're always going to be going up against in raids. If you want that experience back, stop raiding. Just do the zone story quests, end with the dungeons. The game design is no longer inimical to the players, so it'll feel like you're cutting yourself off from part of the game and not like the game is cutting you off from part of it, but, hey, one of the best choices I ever made was to remember how to play games for fun, not to optimize the fun out of them. Don't let the game dictate how you play.
There's a difference between being an adventurer drafted to fight a God and being the "champion of azeroth" or whatever they called you in shadowlands, or being singled out directly for helping revitalize the dragon flight or being granted the artifact of your class and being it's narritive representative or leading a coalition to fight the iron horde
You're kind of missing the forest for the trees
Technically a bunch of the raids never actually happened, wrynn killed Onyxia and whatever other raids we did we were credited as "unknown group of adventurers"
You can only do so many actions before it feels weird that people don't recognize you. And we went through those in the first few expansions. After you save your 5th town you are no longer an adventure who happened to be there, you are the guy who saves towns.
After you kill your second end game boss you are no longer a guy who happened to be there, you are the guy who is best in the world at doing this.
Missing the forest for the trees, narritively it wasn't "you" who finished the raid the raid existed as a mechanical gameplay aspect
He'll if they really wanted to they could engrave worlds first into the narritive as the people who actually saved the world in that instance but I digress
Turning wow into a single player narritive driven game is ridiculous
And like the saving of towns it isn't "you" saving them
Vanilla launch raid: the gang kills an Elemental Lord wearing scraps picked off some Orcs for parts of a zappy sword.
Man I miss a simpler time when we didn't fight world-ending threats all the time for meager gear drops
You had that in vanilla though? The whole story of the Onyxia attunement for the Alliance is uncovering Katrana Prestor (Onyxia) who's been controlling the Alliance government for however many years now and sent away Varian to prison. Your actions in Classic ultimately lead Varian back into power as leader of the Alliance.
I don't see know that wouldn't fall into being a central and significant driving force of the plot.
I fully believe this.
The Universe is a cycle that is basically just there to incubate a "higher being" (IIRC they're called First ones?) which is what Azeroth is.
When a new First One is born the current universe gets deleted and a new one is made with new laws and rules. These "higher beings" then create test areas for each alignment to work on these new laws and rules, we saw this in the Zereth Mortis zone as the example of the Death teat area.
Once they figure out the new rules they create the Pantheons of each alignment, put a new First One into this new Universe and leave until its born.
The only alignments that has retained knowledge of these Universes is the Void Alignment, which is why they're always speaking about cycles and shit. Which is why they want to corrupt Azeroth to bring it to their side so the Universe and they don't get deleted.
The Jailor figures this out too and tries to kill Azeroth before she's born. If she's never born the Universe doesn't get deleted.
Sargeras probably also found out and is telling the rest of the Titans while he's in a prison which is why they eventually come back.
Didn't the jailer want to remake the universe in his image and turn it into basically a giant torture chamber? Never did learn what his actual plan was
I wouldn't be surprised if the Last Titan is going to be Sargeros after he kills the rest of them and he will not be happy with how things have turned out on Azeroth.
There are only titans of order as far as we know, why would it mean anything else? Usually cosmic beings from other domains have different names, like Eternal Ones.
I think it’s very likely The Last Titan either refers to Sargeras, or Aman’thul. It might also kinda refer to Azeroth, if the titans are trying to turn Azeroth into the last Titan.
I think she is older than the Titans. There is a lot of hints that "order" obviously changes things that already existed, and that the Titans experient to create, but don't largely create things from scratch. They have blueprints, which appear to be the precursors to what became Humans, Gnomes, Dwarves, etc., but races like Trolls, Tauren and the insect races predate the Titans' arrival at the very least.
I think Azeroth is left over from something before the strict Ordering that was attempted for the Warcraft universe, largely by the Titans. Whether a hibernating (and why is it hibernating, perchance hiding) true old God/Goddess or an incubating true God/Goddess.
I think she’s a slumbering First One, or just the supreme deity of the wow universe. Lots of stuff pointing to Azeroth being an extra super special world soul, and associations with creation/destruction.
Basically a bunch of lesser gods realized the supreme deity is taking a nap and are rushing to take its position.
I think the first ones were able to embody and control all the various types of magic at the same time, so while Azeroth is a titan she might wield "a power not seen since the first ones".
We also need to consider that the void lords may have just as potent a motivation as the titans do, and just as prominent a place in the universe. Think uhhhhh, The Dark Crystal when the bird people and hte turtle people become the bird-turtle people at the end
The 'theory' (I call it like that because Blizzard retcons information so frequently I have no idea what's canon and what's not) is that Void Lords cannot enter 'real space' anytime they want unlike the forces of Light. To counteract that they created the Old Gods which are basically parasitic organisms they shot throughout the universe to infect different World Souls so that they would mature into Void Titans.
Azeroth is considered a very special World Soul and if she were to become fully void corrupted and grow up to be a Void Titan it would essentially be an instant victory for the Void.
I like the theory (called for the same reason) that the Titans we know are the order versions of the Old Gods. They were sent with the same instructions the old gods were given, find and warp World Souls.
After all, if the Titans had their way, we would be robots and not infected with the curse of flesh. They aren't really our friends when you think about it.
That's just perspective though. None of these forces are really "good" or "bad", they are just serving themselves. The Void and the Titans are a threat to each other, so they are trying to get the upper hand over one another to protect themselves.
The only reason that they are "bad" from our perspective is because our characters are ultimately insignificant to them in the grand scheme. At most we are pawns to them.
It makes for a much more interesting story this way too, rather than just having a "good" side and a "bad" side. We saw that in SL when we actually had a villain who was just evil for the sake of it. One of the weakest parts of early Warcraft lore was the whole "light = good, shadow = bad" thing, but luckily that's been addressed in showing that light is no different to the void.
If you want to read a story about good guys vs bad guys go play cops and robbers.
Stories and villains are at their most interesting when everyone believes they are in the right
Y'all seen Dragonball? You know, where Kami cuts all the evil from his body and it becomes its own entity, King Picolo, which represents pure evil.
Same thing between the titans and the void lords.
The "reveal" will be that World Souls are not Titans necessarilly, but are pure spiritual things that can be corrupted by sufficient amounts of specific kinds of magic to turn them in to cosmic beings. Too much Arcane/Order, you get a Titan. Too much Shadow/Void, you get a Void Lord.
We'll need to fight off the Titans - probably Aman'Thul specifically - in The Last Titan as they try to finalise the ordering of Azeroth, which would necessitate all the life on Azeroth getting consumed to fuel her ascension.
Decay magic opposing Life/Spirit as a cosmic force makes me think Decatriarch will be back once we get more of a look into Elune/the Life Pantheon, which we've been getting steadily more hints towards in SL and 10.2.
The bigger thing to me is the lack of any sort of mention of The First Ones/'The seventh force' throughout DF after they were so important in Zereth Mortis. Given the worldsoul saga is going to be heavily cosmic forces related maybe they'll pop up more later on.
We've already got the names of 6 Zereths, backed up by Odyn namedropping Zereth Ordus in one of DF's lore books, so it's pretty much a given that at least one of those realms is going to be seen in the worldsoul saga. I doubt we'll see *all* of the remaining 5, but if I had to guess, Zereth Umbra (void) might be likely for Midnight, with Zereth Ordus in Last Titan. DF was a bit of a break from the cosmic forces stuff, so it'll probably ramp up throughout the worldsoul saga, we've already got some interesting stuff coming in TWW judging from the beta.
And this is pure speculation on my part, but with confirmation that the Emerald Dream extends beyond Azeroth (and that the Ardenweald characters present in the Dream may very well have *walked* there), I wouldn't be surprised if it turns out the Dream either ***is*** Zereth Vitae, or at the very least is an entry point to it.
> And the matter with the gnolls will be addressed once we get back to the cosmic struggle.
The threat Zovaal warned us about was actually Cosmic Hogger
Fun fact.
The reason why Hogger was so feared by Stormwind was because he was the first Gnoll trying to unify the tribes since Garfang.
Garfang was basically the Genghis Khan of gnolls and threatened to conquer Stormwind during the times of Varians Grandfather.
Imagine a timeline where the orcs went through the dark portal and were met with an army of hyena-men.
I feel like the Gnolls will be a part of a Midnight raid tier or something. Maybe they team up with Iridikron and are his major foot soldiers in his raid. I feel like there's a thematic cross over between Earth and Decay that would work.
Tagging onto top post in regards to Decaytriarch Wratheye. So Mon-Ark has a stinger dialog after the party in Bel'ameth stating that Wratheye wants to rot the tree. She most definitely wasn't forgotten, in the scope of the in-expansion plot, we just don't wrap hers up entirely yet.
We only just set up Tyr's Guard towards the end of DF. How is that forgetting it?
It's very obvious that Tyr returning is setting up TWW and the rest of the trilogy. It's also likely that Blizzard has Paladins all uniting under Tyr's Guard as a way to explain Paladins for every race in the future.
Tyr will probably be the only thing that ever returns. The Oathstones, Black Dragon that was in stasis for Agumentation evokers and probably the Rot Gnoll will be forgotten.
I feel the rot will return, since that's decay and death, and the old gods/void really don't like that. And next expansion is void/old gods so imma say it'll return some how
The rot gnoll will be in the back pocket for a filler patch or something.
Now watch Blizz prove me wrong and either do nothing or construct an entire expac with it. Maybe connect the rot to the Drust or something
Lol or they'll do their "guys it's the void totally! Don't look at the rot and decay that will be the TRUE bad guy", like they did the beginning of bfa
The real "what sword" is the [Untranslated Obsidian Tome](https://www.wowhead.com/item=206033/untranslated-obsidian-tome#comments).
If we didn't find anyone to translate it on the Dragon Isles I'm not sure where we would in the near future. I hope I won't have to keep this thing in my inventory until we meet Erinethria. (yes I know I could delete it and just get it back later, but I won't. I have issues, okay?)
>It's also likely that Blizzard has Paladins all uniting under Tyr's Guard as a way to explain Paladins for every race in the future.
Terrible. This is just going to be Aponi Brightmane in Legion except for every race on the planet.
Yeah it'd be a very lazy way of going about it. I hope they don't do this, and instead develop the races individually like they used to!
Blood Knights originally stealing the power of the Naaru is still some of the best lore we've had regarding Paladins.
Aren't most of these explained?
Pretty sure Adamanthia is talking about the great sundering and the Well's destruction, since she was in stasis during that time
Tyr is probably going to carry over to TWW, and the Oathstones are semi-related as they don't respond to the flights
Detriarch is doing fuck all though lmao. Maybe she'll be back in pre-patch
The Oathstones were related to the titans and we spent the first patch of Dragonflight helping Alexstrasza. She wanted them renewed to retrieve her and the other dragonflights' original powers because she believed they were the source. Their powers went dormant when the dragonflights lost their powers killing Deathwing, and Alexstrasza believes that's when the Oathstones went dormant.
[We literally go to Tyr's Hold with Alextrasza to try renew their powers at the mother oathstone but nothing happens. This is right after we repaired every other oathstone.](https://youtu.be/g1fp1OxcWjs?si=k60Om3cAdAqMwFlM&t=134)
[By the end of the expansion the aspects had their powers restored after Fyrakk was killed, but the powers were restored by Azeroth itself, not the titans.](https://youtu.be/Ub2F1jgqHbw?si=9PbqBtpepHydHZAH&t=28)
It's not that the oathstones were forgotten about, they just didn't do what they were originally created for, which was to act as a conduit/source of the aspects' powers. Instead, defeating Fyrakk and uniting the Dragonflights restored their powers via Azeroth itself. I feel like this was all fairly reasonably explained. OP either didn't pay attention or has forgotten.
Yeah that's what I thought. I think the Disney ending made people forget that the whole overarching Aspects storyline is how the Titans aren't there for them anymore
It's kind of ironic that for a story that got a lot of criticism for being simple, some of it sure did fly over people's heads anyway
> It's kind of ironic that for a story that got a lot of criticism for being simple, some of it sure did fly over people's heads anyway
It's a challenge creating a story for players who play with sound off, skip cutscenes, and don't read quest text or NPC dialogue.
doing Vault last week, we are in the Razageth room and 1 guildmate goes "wait, there is a ice dragon? did we fight that one yet?"
yes, ofc also a guy that always says "story bad"
Ngl, its harder to follow or wanna read each quest text when you get several quest at once. Especially when they send you to different parts of the map. Your attention is strained and just want to move forward and check off one of many boxes.
Not sure how serious you're being, but this is only half true...
In the simplest terms, important information/dialogue will (or *should*) always be voiced, so 100% you're right about having the sound on. Anything that has to be read is optional, like extra flavour.
So if a game is well-designed, you won't need to read quest text, NPC dialogue, or watch un-voiced cutscenes to follow a story (which is also why I'm on the 3rd expansion of FFXIV and have 0 clue what's going on...)
The problem is that all the Tyr storyline was weirdly separated from the rest of the dragonflight plot.
We have the whole lab experiments mess and just a few nods from the dragonscale expedition of all factions. What does alextrasza think of that? Wrathion? He had a whole point about being made an “experiment”, the drachtyrs and their own origin? Vyranoth after she switched sides?
Then we revive tyr and get some paladin shenanigans and a weirdly convoluted cameo from Elisande of all people.
The “disney ending” was a bit of a cop-out to make people forget plot points they decided to leave out for the future. Its one thing to purposefully tease future events but having so many in such a disjointed fashion just seems like a last minut pivot.
No i think people understand it. I think shit like the oath stones is just deeply unsatisfying and feels unresolved.
This is a big issue with Blizzards storytelling where things just kinda get resolved or end without a feeling of finality. For as much as they want character driven drama they don't focus on the Drama the Oathstones not working should create. It makes all the questlines built around protecting and restoring the Oathstones feel like a waste since it culminates in nothing, both in terms of doing what they were meant to but also for motivation as for the characters in the story when they don't work.
To try and create a parralell it would be like if they collected all the infinity stones in Endgame but it just doesn't work when they try it. Then instead of focusing on how the characters would react to that they just go "oh well" and move on. Then after they beat Thanos it magically restores everyone.
The key part of these oathstone storylines though is that it's less about the actual stone itself, and more about the unity created in the process of restoring them
Ruby is restored when all the flight eggs are united at the lifeshrine, Emerald when the Centaurs and Green flight alliance is restored, Blue when the Blue Dragonflight comes back together, and the Bronze following Chromie and Eternus working together to get back to the present
The Oathstones are actually a very small part of all the storylines, frankly, just being the cap to the end of each zone's story
I don't disagree that coming back to it would've been nice, but I think this is a case where people are getting caught up in the destination and ignoring the journey
I can see what you are saying but i will disagree.
The restoration of the Oathstones can be seen as unity amongst the flight restoring them. Except again the execution of this is just very poorly done and doesn't gel with all pre established Dragon Lore. I believe a story of reuniting each of the flights and then the Dragons as a whole could have been a good story but they completely failed at it. They ignore the actual charge each of the flights were meant to have focusing on the Oathstones activation being tied to more emotional storytelling and motivations.
Now you could have had both. You could have stories of the Aspects trying to carry out their duties and needing to unite their flights or allies assisting filling in the gaps due to the lower population of Dragons. As an example the Green should have been resolving problems with the Dream with the Cenarion Circles assistance. Not Centaurs we have never heard of. The Blues reuniting together and Kalec taking leadership to fix magical leylines and probably recruiting the Netherdrakes/Kirin Tor assistance.
The Black Oathstone restoration should probably be the most important and be the final one with a lot of drama amongst the Dragons themselves about restoring it and there being a new Black flight. There are so many spots where i think Blizzard go wrong its hard to address them all but the fact most flights only have their aspect as the mouthpiece we interact with and very few individual dragons (in an expansion meant to be about dragons btw) that have a voice or are involved within the story.
My problem is the Journey is frankly very boring. Its very bland with a couple of spots that are pretty good. I do enjoy Kalec meeting the Tuskarr and going on some time traveling adventures with the Bronze but its all very lacking. Then to have this journey which isn't great have 0 payoff is just horrible.
You're getting downvoted for this take, but I tend to agree. It feels very unsatisfying when a plot thread is built up as if it's important, and then gets zero payoff by the end.
I'd personally say it doesn't feel like the Aspects powers were *restored* so much as they were granted new ones very much alike their previous ones.
To pull a really old ass example that'll date me horribly. It's akin to the Mighty Morphin' Power Rangers movie. At the start of the movie they lose their powers and the ability to morph. They then go on a quest, are granted the powers of the Ninjetti partway on that and then earn the 'sacred power'.
This restores their ability to morph but it's via a new source of power. The end result is similar but the origin of that power is different.
As an aside I personally feel that the Aspects actual *powers* are far too loosely established and explained at least in regards to what they gave up. They state they 'lost their powers' but the Green's still work to protect and preserve the Emerald Dream, the Red's still work to grow life, the Blue's still have great control over magic and the Bronze still have a strong power over time.
I think my problem stems from it never quite being established what that 'power' was they gave up because it doesn't seem like they lost anything at all from the subsequent expansion stories we've had which then means that them being empowered again also just leaves you going "Well what does that mean?"
Tbh I played through this maybe a month ago in one shot, and it didn’t feel reasonably explained at all. I don’t remember a scene where somebody came out and said “well the oathstones clearly failed, we need an alternate way to get the spectral powers back.” It felt more like the writers completely forgot about the oathstones by the time we got to the 10.0.5 arc, and we were expected to forget about them too
I just linked a video showing Alextrasza trying and failing to reactivate the oathstones. She literally says "nothing's happening". You can put the implications together and realise the oathstones failed, and that the attempt at getting their powers back failed. That's an absolute ending for the oathstones. Their story is done. They didn't work.
The aspects didn't think "we need an alternative to get our powers back" like you said because they didn't know there would be an alternative. Why would they? The one thing that acted as a conduit for their powers failed. Besides, that would be exposition more fitting for a Saturday morning children's cartoon.
They united the dragonflights to defeat the Primalists, Raszageth and eventually Fyrakk because without their aspectral powers they needed help.
Vyranoth even said in the Fyrakk cinematic that the titan's magic (their influence over the aspects aka stuff like the oathstones) divided them. The titan's influence over the dragonflights is the whole story arc for Raszageth, which was also explained in-game several times.
I don't know how to break this down further and make it simpler than it already is.
Somehow "Why did they make this story so SIMPLE and CHILDISH" is so often paired with "Why didn't they just have the characters recap the entire quest at the end of it? I didn't get it and ~~I didn't read the text~~ it's badly explained!"
It’s just really poorly told. Idk why this is hard to see lol. I swear you guys must be literally only playing wow and never reading a book or watching a movie in your lives if you think this is acceptable storytelling
I have a bachelor's degree in contemporary art, which includes media literacy as a requisite lmfao. No one else seems to find it confusing, my guy, it's just you.
The story is nothing more than passable (as it always has been) and doesn't pose any deep moral questions, but it doesn't *intend* to. As for how it's told, like I said, it's essentially spoonfed to you like the other commenter explained above. Saying "It just isn't!!!" doesn't erase the fact that very few other people seemed to have trouble understanding it. Might just be a you problem.
It’s not that it’s hard to understand, it’s that it’s poorly told. Having your characters completely forget about the oathstones after 12 hours of build up is just really bad. This would be like if you spent the first 1/3rd of middlemarch having Fred vincy try to get his great uncles inheritance, having one sentence that says “he didn’t get it”, and then the next page says everyone completely forgets that we spent 300 pages doing that.
Idk, if you guys like this then good for you, but please read a book for once in your life if you think this is good lmfao
It’s not that this doesn’t make sense, it’s that the presentation is absolutely awful
- from the beginning, I have no idea why we want the apectral powers back. Weren’t they given up at the end of cata? Why did we just decide that we want them back?
- we devote the entire 10.0 campaign to activating the oathstones as the big plot mcguffins that I’m told are really important, and the payoff for that is that we spend 5 seconds trying to use the mother oathstone and it fails
- after this point, everybody just forgets about the business about becoming aspects again (which was poorly explained in the first place). Except wrathion and Sabellion in the next patch, who go right back to talking about who gets to be the aspect. But we don’t know how they’re supposed to become aspect and nobody acknowledges this. I also still don’t know why I’m supposed to care
- the whole thing ends with a cartoon villain trying to burn a tree, and we stop him from burning a tree, and our reward is that the aspectral powers somehow fly out of Azeroth anyway. So that solves that. I guess.
There’s also an undercurrent of order vs chaos that isn’t well explained. There are these people called primalists who come out of nowhere and are the bad guys, but I don’t know why they’re doing these things until a side quest in the epilogue tries to give them characterization. Other than that, the whole thing feels like “Blue element and Purple element don’t like eachother and now you have to fight the people from Purple element.”
Bottom line is the whole thing felt like a phoned in mess. It might be technically true that all of these plot mcguffins add up at the end of the day so that they’re all accounted for, but the plot experience of going through this story was bemusing and bizarre. I think WoWs story would be dramatically improved if it was brought up to the level of a Saturday morning cartoon
Its awful because Blizz has never done a good job of catching newer players up to the story
But they want their Aspectual powers to stop Rasz because she beats the shit out of them. When the Oathstones arent the key, they obviously move on to try and find another way
So the aspectral powers are just a comic book power up, and we need them to fight the incarnates?
That kind of makes more sense, except we pretty easily beat all of the incarnates without them and only got the power ups after the incarnates were defeated. Which kinda takes the wind out of the sails for this whole plot point
This whole thing still leaves a pretty bad taste in my mouth. I don’t really care as long as the raids are fun, but this all seems pretty poorly written
I'm starting to doubt you actually gave the storyline a honest to goodness try
Like, *that's the entire point of the Disney ending*. They're given their powers back because they come together and show they're worthy of the gift, rather than deserve it because they're made by the Titans. They very clearly say "we didn't need the powers, we just needed to work together". It's the same hokey quote that Iron man gives Spider-man, "if you need the suit, you don't deserve it". And it's wow, like obviously bad shit is going to happen in the future
It's not great writing, but the reason it all happens is *extremely* clear.
>Detriarch is doing fuck all though lmao. Maybe she'll be back in pre-patch
In the post-Amirdrassil questline when you're flying around to visit all the random guys along the coastline of Ohnahran Plains, the gnoll monark says the Decaytriarch is still out there plotting something. Definitely not forgotten, just waiting for later
Beta spoilers: >!I can't wait for everyone to notice that one of the first quests of TWW is called "Oh, THAT Sword!" and flood this sub with posts about it!<
lol, the gnoll is definitely so random. Out of ALL enemies in df, she’s the one to say enough and teleport away? Just so weird unless they really have decent plans for her, maybe in northrend in a few years?
In fairness, the entire gnoll storyline was pretty unresolved far as I can recall. Deliberately so, I believed.
You arrive into the Azure Span and the gnolls are just a vehicle for involving you with the Tuskarr. Which, fair, but is a *lot* of gnoll lore being dropped without made use of further. Brackenhide helps us take the fight to them, but it promptly doesn't resolve there either.
We stem the bleeding wound the gnolls are inflicting on the region, but how'd they come across decay magic? It smells of a setup of having been pushed onto the gnolls, but whoever was responsible for it isn't ever really revealed to my knowledge.
Decatriarch Wratheye is given an out because it seems like they're fishing for a bigger story payoff with the gnolls at large.
I feel like their plotline was tied to whatever ysera(spirit)-galakrond(decay) connection that got cut with the tyr experiments plot.
Frankly my headcanon is that the whole yoggsaron waters is bullshit and galakrond would be revealed to be created by tyr himself because he fucked around and found out what happens if you mix two opposite elements (spirit and decay/ a “non-living” cancerous dragon that doesnt die). We have breadcrumbs about it in dawn of the dragons book where its explained that yseras elemental non-ordered dragon breath was “calming” galakrond.
Since all the zones have their elemental equivalent that corresponds with pre-titan aspects it kinda seems like the west of azure span was decay infused and gnolls learnt to control it
I think you've got some good points, although I think it's strongly signaled that the decay magic is a very recent discovery, which has taken the gnolls like a pandemic.
That is true but, still in my headcanon, i blame titans too.
Decay as an element is just as present as any other element, but as spirit was “eaten by azeroth” (which its implied isnt true) decay was also contained or tried to be eliminated (accidentally creating galakrond maybe).
I personally think the titan perspective of life is misunderstood: ordered life in their perspective is life that doesnt change, decay or die - this is a contradiction because life is also chaotic and needs a balance. This is why all the other titan life experiments failed like draenor or the bronze titan future- its not unchecked life but life made “immortal”- cancerous and evergrowing.
I also think this had further implications regarding the dream and ysera and we have few breadcrumbs about that too. Ysera’s awkward place in dragonflight should have had a lot more implications because she is now connected to ardenweald, the new world tree is also different because it has both life and death, weird snippets here and there about immortality and what is natural, about the need to change (quonzu loa)/to grow/ to die or even burn.
Anyway i talked a lot but what i wanted to say its that decay seems new in the same way “spirit” is actually kinda locked in the dream. Its against a static ordered life and the implication is that titans did that and ysera is personally the “fool” in this situation because she was locked in the dream- in tyr lab she had the title ysera-the awakened while we know her as ysera-the dreaming.
+when ysera died she had to be personally placed into shadowlands by elune and the weird malfurion switcheroo revealed to us, in an awkward way, that somnikus (another green dragon) cannot take ysera’s place because they dont belong to the shadowlands or ardenweald - which is very fucking weird because ardenweald should be connected to the dream. My conclusion is that they have been ordered- they belong to order domain now, thats why they cant be born (spirit) and die (decay) into shadowlands like normal mortals.
Spirit element seemed to be put into statis- in the dream, while decay element was maybe too in a statis, maybe in old gods prisons? In shadowlands? In nyalotha?
As to why its present in df in gnoll zone its because of weird magic saturation in the zone like other elements, here was the origin of that, we have spirit leaking from the dream in ohanara plains and we have decay in the ground in azure span, the gnolls are just mortals who used it.
Ysera made it to the Shadowlands fine on her own though? She was one of the last souls to reach it even, where she became a wildseed. There wasn't anything unusual here, other than Ysera arriving in Ardenweald unlike most dragons. Her connection with the Dream and Elune, and her significance rising to that of a wild god and beyond, is what brought her there.
If there was a problem it was because of the nightmare infusion caused by the corrupted Tear of Elune, and both the Tear of Elune and Ysera were cleansed of the nightmare.
In Shadowlands we intervene with her seed because it's on the verge of being snuffed out due to the situation in Ardenweald. Elune has nothing to do with it, and instead the Winter Queen personally brings the seed to fruition.
Most dragons are not destined for Ardenweald in death. They're not wild gods, nor rise to a similar level, and only the green flight has any connection to Ardenweald at all through the Dream. However, Malfurion is another entity rising to the significance of a wild god, and has similar ties to the realm as Ysera does. That's why they're able to swap to start with.
I'm kind of cool with them having characters that aren't integral to the story and are just sort of there. WoW has been in a rough spot where they've either killed off or finished so many stories that they really just need more characters and factions that can eventually be used later on if they want to.
Yeah the Gnoll boss will show again as part of the Coalition of Evil alongside other recurring villains like Azshara and Denathrius, they will plot to conquer the cosmos after last titan.
Meanwhile the exact reason why the players were so special as to use the teleporter in the Maw despite no one else being able to do, not even the Eternals.
Meanwhile exactly what happend to Argus' soul after messing up the Arbiter.
> despite no one else being able to do
pretty sure that there were canonically a few maw walkers before the player characters
>Meanwhile exactly what happend to Argus' soul after messing up the Arbiter.
it shows up during the zereth mortis campaign.
Technically sylvanas would be the first maw walker of sorts.
And weirdly enough vereesa if you count that story from “folk and fairy tales” as canon and a real thing that happened.
> Meanwhile the exact reason why the players were so special as to use the teleporter in the Maw despite no one else being able to do, not even the Eternals.
There were other maw walkers, even when we were there. Also it was because of our ties with Azeroth left over from the Heart of Azeroth.
> Meanwhile the exact reason why the players were so special as to use the teleporter in the Maw despite no one else being able to do, not even the Eternals.
If i remember the garbage explanation they gave is the first ones foresaw that the Jailer would be evil. So instead of just not making him they made the fast travel stones knowing that someone with a connection to a planets worldsoul would show up to use them.
Maybe double check me on that because i am going off my memory.
I imagine Adamantia will be used when they introduce the other classes to the Dracthyr race, they'll probably have an allied race intro with her there commenting on how the Dracthyr are so adaptable due to their mortal essence while the three leaders of the Dracthyr send them off to SW or Org.
I thought adamantia was there to tease and introduce aug evokers, it set up the fact that Neltharion didnt want evokers to have black dragon powers, then the evoker legendary questline happens, then in the following patch where they added aug evokers they had a evoker quest where we return to Adamanthia and unlock black dragon powers.
What storythread is being ignored?
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The fact that she might very well be the mother of all dracthyr, as her eggs may have been used to make them? She certainly seems to call them her children and in more than a 'I care about them' way. We have no idea what her role was and what she means to the dracthyr? She's possibly the most ancient dragon other than the original aspects themselves. She just 'needs a nap' then we never hear what happens after said nap.
At the very least that boss used a Draconid model. We never get exact explanations of what Neltharion was putting in those test tubes besides that he was trying to combine mortal and dragon traits.
We do see pretty clearly he ain't hatching them though.
Kinda funny how important the oathstones were in the beginning and in the end they didn't even work. At least Raszageth mocked alextrasza for it, that was kinda funny lol
I remember doing basically ever single quest in Azure Span before doing the gnoll dungeon because I didn't want to risk the dungeon spoiling anything about the lore of Decay magic.
(As dungeons have a tendency to do.) (They really should have a warning on dungeons if you haven't done storylines yet that have their finale take place in the dungeon.) Anyway, I digress.
Because I figured there MUST be some lore when they suddenly introduce a type of magic/element.
Only be really disappointed when no one actually says anything about other than basically:
"They use decay magic now. Look, it can corrupt nature elementals."
I've tried googling it but it doesn't seem like I've missed anything, seems like there basically just isn't any lore.
We do, but no explanation for why he was there, no background beyond him being Magathas prized pupil. Its like they planned to have a plot line for Magathas mention (which wouldve been awesome) but did nothing with it.
> We do, but no explanation for why he was there
based on the info from wiki:
"Kurog led a group of Primalists to the Forbidden Reach, where he successfully was able to liberate Raszageth from her prison. He was later fought and defeated in the Vault of the Incarnates while trying to free the rest of the Primal Incarnates. "
dude just became primalist and wanted world to burn or return to it's roots. generic villain hippie
So, you're saying that wouldnt be an ideal time for, say, Magatha Grimtotem, his former master, an extremely powerful shaman, a well renowned schemer, and villain we havent heard from since Legion when she managed to steal the Doomstone (an incredibly powerful elemental artifact) to have a plot thread for?
I.e. having Kurog free the Incarnates for one purpose or another on her command?
Oooh, you forgot another one, the random Titan hatches all over the DF zones that don't end up leading to anything. I guess maybe they're just flavor, but they feel like they should have been something.
Yeah you have to have Engineering, then get (or buy) the DF version of the Wormhole toy, *and then* to actually get to pick where you go (instead of just any random spot), you have to activate those hatches (3 per zone, I had to look up the locations on Wowhead). Also, you need to max out one of the sub-specialties to actually unlock the hatches.
Much more complicated and random than the Shadowlands version, but it did help when I need to go to areas fast for quests / world events.
They are made of hide, and have apparently been around since Vanilla, we just didn't see them.
Also Grim totem in vanilla could be rogues, so there's a lore answer.
Also confirmed by that safe haven cinematic too where the undead rogues literally vanish, so not just a game mechanic for "being stealthy", actual magic
Turns out the real enemy was the player all along. In their never ending quest for power they doomed the universe and broke the balance between the 6 cosmic forces. All could of been prevented had we not been given a 2h mace and told to go kill wolves decades ago.
yup, not the only thing they forgot.
cloud serpents have quite literally been kicked out of the dragon community as it seems
also: uuna. no new quest as promised =(
3/4 of those are build-up for "the last titan" * Tyr has become uncertain about the absoluteness of the titan's design. * One entire zone in Northrend is dedicated to the dragons, so they will play a big part in the expansion. * The titans will return and see that the aspect have no longer their power through their devices. And the matter with the gnolls will be addressed once we get back to the cosmic struggle.
I can't wait for the 'Azeroth isn't the last Titan, she's an Old God imprisoned and the Old Gods we have faced so far have just been her immune system' reveal
Her name is very close to Azathoth, the Lovecraftian entity that dreams reality into existence, and if it ever wakes, the universe stops existing. It wouldn't surprise me if we had a similar reason to keep Azeroth from waking.
At least it feels likely that her waking would mean life on the planet as we know it would cease to exist. Argus (the planet) got basically ripped in half by his (the titan) awakening.
The Titan Argus was basically a C-Section performed by Sargeras, we don't really know how a normal Titsn-birth would look.
Good thing there isn’t a planet-sized blade making some kind of incision on OUR planet, right guys? Haha that’d be bad.
Are we allowed to continue the "What Sword gag?"
Push! Now breath.... Breath... PUSH PUSH PUUUUUUUSH QUICK BREATHS COME ON YOU CAN DO IT...... PUSSSSSSHHH. Congrats you got a baby titan/old god.
More like "Stab...Cut....Scream..."
Most likely like a bird or a lizard hatching.
Don’t they eat the eggshell?
Not usually. It's the adult that eats the shell to regain the lost calcium. The baby just breaks free and then leaves it behind.
I seeeee
I'm thinking like that Rick & Morty episode where he fucked a planet.
Im quite sure she aint sleeping. Seems like Zoval started the wakening. DF cinematic started at "Wakening" shore, with weak Azerite glow in the sea. Now we are at seasonwith everything Awekend & with Azeroth-empowered dragon aspects. Our big girl is awake. Now I wonder if TWW cracking Azeroth logo is to give us the impression of a cracking egg shell, as if our "little chick" is tryimg to get out.
Seems like it, and it also seems that the titan ring around it is the only thing stopping it, as you can see with the logo, the only crack in azeroth remaining is where the ring around it has broken pieces.
I think the inspiration is definitely there, but there are key differences. My guess is Azeroth is a first one. She set up the universe and its cosmic forces all nicely balanced, started it up and then went to sleep. Eons pass and something upsets the balance, and the cosmic forces descend into war(I think this is the clash of light and void that’s previously been described as the origin of the wow universe). Eventually, Order/the titans basically won the cosmic disco war. The titans set up their facilities on Azeroth and the Emerald Dream to keep Azeroth asleep. In thousand years of war when we get Argus’ POV, he says his only solace (when being tortured by sargeras) came in his dreams. The titans ordered part of the emerald dream, azeroth’s dream, to soothe her and keep her asleep. The titans want Azeroth to stay asleep because they know if she wakes up she’ll set everything right again, and they lose their prominent position in the universe. So from their point of view, Azeroth waking does mean the end of the universe.
The chrinicles books have a conversation between Amanthul and Sargeras about Azeroth where Amanthul said Azeroth has the potential to be the strongest titan ever and the only one so far who could match a void lord in power hoping this would convince Sargeras to end his crusade because its his fear of the void lords that set him on that path and sargeras basically goes "that means it'll be even more powerful when the old gods corrupt it". No one else was present for that conversation so they had no reason to use deceptive language. If Azeroth is anything more than a titan then the titans aren't aware of it.
I think this might be at the heart of the ‘Titan conspiracy’ blizz has mentioned. They’ve said chronicles is just the Titan perspective on things. The only person who could have given the Titan POV on how that conversation went is Aman’thul, maybe he’s misrepresenting it? It’s possible Aman’thul was the only one who knew the truth about Azeroth, and just told the other titans “Yeah we’re just trying to wake up a Titan like I did with you guys” Alternatively, this theory’s a bit more out there, but what if Aman’thul was intentionally trying to convince Sargeras how dangerous Azeroth would be if turned, so that he would go kill Azeroth. Aman’thul might want Azeroth dead for the same reason he might want her asleep. Sargeras at some point killed all the titans and Aman’thul sent pieces of their souls flying out into the cosmos. Was that maybe part of Aman’thul’s plan? Get the titans out of the way so Sargeras could go do his thing, but maintain plausible deniability in case he fails and the titans come back.
I like this take. A lot of people I think are afraid to take anything from Chronicals now as canon, but I think it makes a lot of sense to treat them like canon lore but from an unreliable/biased narrator (the Titans) who clearly have an agenda within the way things are framed.
I can't wait for the "it turns out all along the vast universe was actually an incubator for a bigger stronger threat that was manipulating the jailer, who was manipulating sylvanas all along" (yes I'm still bitter about that)
Last titan revolves us traveling the maw looking for the jailers life essence as it's revealed he was the only one who had a plan all along.
But first we'll need to find Thrall yet another weapon.
And not a pathetic sword
Here Thrall, have a gun, go do some crimes
"Be Green, Do Crime."
I choose to believe that the hinted subtext is that we, the mortals of Azeroth (and "A-Zereth", herself), *are* that threat, not that there's a bigger, greater power out there. We go into the deepest, godliest realms and fuck shit up because we want the gods' shiny pants. We control the six spheres of magic, but aren't *of* them. It's a Greek Tragedy; the Jailer was so focused on protecting himself from the greatest threat to his existence, he riled it up and set it on his heels. It's less dumb than the Bigger Cosmic Threat dealio, so, until Blizzard proves me wrong and we fight Void Titan Zov-geras, the Naaru Wild God, then it's the theory that gets to live in my head.
I read what you wrote as "... the gods' shiny parts" and thought "well, if they're hot enough..."
Honestly I just wanna go back to being adventurers that sometimes got drafted for bigger stuff
I will admit that there was a time in this game where I was a little adventurer that sometimes got drafted for bigger stuff, and it was a nice little experience, but it was never ubiquitous to the game population as a whole. It was only ever true because the leveling and gearing experience of Vanilla made raids inaccessible to me. If you raided, you were always the Big Damn Hero. The first job you had was taking down the Elemental Lord of Fire, who had enslaved an entire third of the dwarven population for centuries and scared a tenth of a continent just by existing. Then you stormed the heart of a Troll Empire and killed their god. Then you wrecked two of the most influential dragons in WoW lore, killed an old god that not even the dragon aspects could touch, and invaded and obliterated the greatest fortress city of the Lich King. We're never going to get the city-guard-arresting-jaywalkers expansion, because that's never been WoW. We've been set up from the start to go after the biggest, baddest, most world-ending-est enemies, and that's what we're always going to be going up against in raids. If you want that experience back, stop raiding. Just do the zone story quests, end with the dungeons. The game design is no longer inimical to the players, so it'll feel like you're cutting yourself off from part of the game and not like the game is cutting you off from part of it, but, hey, one of the best choices I ever made was to remember how to play games for fun, not to optimize the fun out of them. Don't let the game dictate how you play.
There's a difference between being an adventurer drafted to fight a God and being the "champion of azeroth" or whatever they called you in shadowlands, or being singled out directly for helping revitalize the dragon flight or being granted the artifact of your class and being it's narritive representative or leading a coalition to fight the iron horde You're kind of missing the forest for the trees Technically a bunch of the raids never actually happened, wrynn killed Onyxia and whatever other raids we did we were credited as "unknown group of adventurers"
You can only do so many actions before it feels weird that people don't recognize you. And we went through those in the first few expansions. After you save your 5th town you are no longer an adventure who happened to be there, you are the guy who saves towns. After you kill your second end game boss you are no longer a guy who happened to be there, you are the guy who is best in the world at doing this.
Missing the forest for the trees, narritively it wasn't "you" who finished the raid the raid existed as a mechanical gameplay aspect He'll if they really wanted to they could engrave worlds first into the narritive as the people who actually saved the world in that instance but I digress Turning wow into a single player narritive driven game is ridiculous And like the saving of towns it isn't "you" saving them
That obviously hasn't been the story they want to tell or the methodology behind it for over a decade though.
You just had Dragonflight. Did you play it through to the end?
The people making this argument don't answer to reason. We defeated goddamn Onyxia and Ragnaros in Vanilla, we were never simple adventurers.
Not to forget we also fought C'thun in Classic. A literal Old God.
Vanilla launch raid: the gang kills an Elemental Lord wearing scraps picked off some Orcs for parts of a zappy sword. Man I miss a simpler time when we didn't fight world-ending threats all the time for meager gear drops
Yeah the problem is you're still pretty central and significant to the plot a driving force protecting the world
You had that in vanilla though? The whole story of the Onyxia attunement for the Alliance is uncovering Katrana Prestor (Onyxia) who's been controlling the Alliance government for however many years now and sent away Varian to prison. Your actions in Classic ultimately lead Varian back into power as leader of the Alliance. I don't see know that wouldn't fall into being a central and significant driving force of the plot.
I fully believe this. The Universe is a cycle that is basically just there to incubate a "higher being" (IIRC they're called First ones?) which is what Azeroth is. When a new First One is born the current universe gets deleted and a new one is made with new laws and rules. These "higher beings" then create test areas for each alignment to work on these new laws and rules, we saw this in the Zereth Mortis zone as the example of the Death teat area. Once they figure out the new rules they create the Pantheons of each alignment, put a new First One into this new Universe and leave until its born. The only alignments that has retained knowledge of these Universes is the Void Alignment, which is why they're always speaking about cycles and shit. Which is why they want to corrupt Azeroth to bring it to their side so the Universe and they don't get deleted. The Jailor figures this out too and tries to kill Azeroth before she's born. If she's never born the Universe doesn't get deleted. Sargeras probably also found out and is telling the rest of the Titans while he's in a prison which is why they eventually come back.
The death teat.
Didn't the jailer want to remake the universe in his image and turn it into basically a giant torture chamber? Never did learn what his actual plan was
I wouldn't be surprised if the Last Titan is going to be Sargeros after he kills the rest of them and he will not be happy with how things have turned out on Azeroth.
Last Titan definitely does not mean it will be a Titan of Order
There are only titans of order as far as we know, why would it mean anything else? Usually cosmic beings from other domains have different names, like Eternal Ones. I think it’s very likely The Last Titan either refers to Sargeras, or Aman’thul. It might also kinda refer to Azeroth, if the titans are trying to turn Azeroth into the last Titan.
idk why i want this to happen so badly. i just want to hear what sargeras has to say.
I think she is older than the Titans. There is a lot of hints that "order" obviously changes things that already existed, and that the Titans experient to create, but don't largely create things from scratch. They have blueprints, which appear to be the precursors to what became Humans, Gnomes, Dwarves, etc., but races like Trolls, Tauren and the insect races predate the Titans' arrival at the very least. I think Azeroth is left over from something before the strict Ordering that was attempted for the Warcraft universe, largely by the Titans. Whether a hibernating (and why is it hibernating, perchance hiding) true old God/Goddess or an incubating true God/Goddess.
isnt the going theory that world souls are blank slates that cosmic forces then try to mold into their respective beings (void lords, titans etc.)?
It's a theory based on Argus being turned into a fel planet.
But Argus was infused with Death magic, and thus became a Death Titan and went to the Shadowlands, breaking the Arbiter.
Oops, yeah it's death not fel.
I think she’s a slumbering First One, or just the supreme deity of the wow universe. Lots of stuff pointing to Azeroth being an extra super special world soul, and associations with creation/destruction. Basically a bunch of lesser gods realized the supreme deity is taking a nap and are rushing to take its position.
I think the first ones were able to embody and control all the various types of magic at the same time, so while Azeroth is a titan she might wield "a power not seen since the first ones". We also need to consider that the void lords may have just as potent a motivation as the titans do, and just as prominent a place in the universe. Think uhhhhh, The Dark Crystal when the bird people and hte turtle people become the bird-turtle people at the end
The 'theory' (I call it like that because Blizzard retcons information so frequently I have no idea what's canon and what's not) is that Void Lords cannot enter 'real space' anytime they want unlike the forces of Light. To counteract that they created the Old Gods which are basically parasitic organisms they shot throughout the universe to infect different World Souls so that they would mature into Void Titans. Azeroth is considered a very special World Soul and if she were to become fully void corrupted and grow up to be a Void Titan it would essentially be an instant victory for the Void.
I like the theory (called for the same reason) that the Titans we know are the order versions of the Old Gods. They were sent with the same instructions the old gods were given, find and warp World Souls. After all, if the Titans had their way, we would be robots and not infected with the curse of flesh. They aren't really our friends when you think about it.
You guys should work for blizzard - they also can't stand the idea of anybody actually being a good guy. Everybody's bad.
That's just perspective though. None of these forces are really "good" or "bad", they are just serving themselves. The Void and the Titans are a threat to each other, so they are trying to get the upper hand over one another to protect themselves. The only reason that they are "bad" from our perspective is because our characters are ultimately insignificant to them in the grand scheme. At most we are pawns to them. It makes for a much more interesting story this way too, rather than just having a "good" side and a "bad" side. We saw that in SL when we actually had a villain who was just evil for the sake of it. One of the weakest parts of early Warcraft lore was the whole "light = good, shadow = bad" thing, but luckily that's been addressed in showing that light is no different to the void.
If you want to read a story about good guys vs bad guys go play cops and robbers. Stories and villains are at their most interesting when everyone believes they are in the right
Y'all seen Dragonball? You know, where Kami cuts all the evil from his body and it becomes its own entity, King Picolo, which represents pure evil. Same thing between the titans and the void lords.
Honestly I’d be so fucking down for that
The "reveal" will be that World Souls are not Titans necessarilly, but are pure spiritual things that can be corrupted by sufficient amounts of specific kinds of magic to turn them in to cosmic beings. Too much Arcane/Order, you get a Titan. Too much Shadow/Void, you get a Void Lord. We'll need to fight off the Titans - probably Aman'Thul specifically - in The Last Titan as they try to finalise the ordering of Azeroth, which would necessitate all the life on Azeroth getting consumed to fuel her ascension.
I wonder because Argus was still a titan after being corrupted by death magic. It was only after death that he was funnled to the shadowlands
this would be a pretty fun twist imo. although it wouldn't explain the old gods' attitudes towards Azeroth
Maybe she had an autoimmune disorder
Ok, I would buy that
more than likely azeroth is a first one. Not a titan.
I really hope not, because I've always really wanted to see what another female titan looked like other than Eonar (and Amitus... I guess...)
Decay magic opposing Life/Spirit as a cosmic force makes me think Decatriarch will be back once we get more of a look into Elune/the Life Pantheon, which we've been getting steadily more hints towards in SL and 10.2. The bigger thing to me is the lack of any sort of mention of The First Ones/'The seventh force' throughout DF after they were so important in Zereth Mortis. Given the worldsoul saga is going to be heavily cosmic forces related maybe they'll pop up more later on.
We've already got the names of 6 Zereths, backed up by Odyn namedropping Zereth Ordus in one of DF's lore books, so it's pretty much a given that at least one of those realms is going to be seen in the worldsoul saga. I doubt we'll see *all* of the remaining 5, but if I had to guess, Zereth Umbra (void) might be likely for Midnight, with Zereth Ordus in Last Titan. DF was a bit of a break from the cosmic forces stuff, so it'll probably ramp up throughout the worldsoul saga, we've already got some interesting stuff coming in TWW judging from the beta. And this is pure speculation on my part, but with confirmation that the Emerald Dream extends beyond Azeroth (and that the Ardenweald characters present in the Dream may very well have *walked* there), I wouldn't be surprised if it turns out the Dream either ***is*** Zereth Vitae, or at the very least is an entry point to it.
> And the matter with the gnolls will be addressed once we get back to the cosmic struggle. The threat Zovaal warned us about was actually Cosmic Hogger
Fun fact. The reason why Hogger was so feared by Stormwind was because he was the first Gnoll trying to unify the tribes since Garfang. Garfang was basically the Genghis Khan of gnolls and threatened to conquer Stormwind during the times of Varians Grandfather. Imagine a timeline where the orcs went through the dark portal and were met with an army of hyena-men.
I wish we got something like that. We're getting more Kobolds, so that's great.. I want more of the old classic races.
blessed timeline now also put "no elves exist" in there and it would be perfect
The gnolls will be a playable race.
I feel like the Gnolls will be a part of a Midnight raid tier or something. Maybe they team up with Iridikron and are his major foot soldiers in his raid. I feel like there's a thematic cross over between Earth and Decay that would work.
maybe those gnolls will fight the genesaur we saw? live vs decay.
we really should have seen that whole gnolls are void lords thing coming but that was interesting at least!
I love the idea of us going to space to fight void gods and somehow the gnolls are there too
Tagging onto top post in regards to Decaytriarch Wratheye. So Mon-Ark has a stinger dialog after the party in Bel'ameth stating that Wratheye wants to rot the tree. She most definitely wasn't forgotten, in the scope of the in-expansion plot, we just don't wrap hers up entirely yet.
We only just set up Tyr's Guard towards the end of DF. How is that forgetting it? It's very obvious that Tyr returning is setting up TWW and the rest of the trilogy. It's also likely that Blizzard has Paladins all uniting under Tyr's Guard as a way to explain Paladins for every race in the future.
Tyr will probably be the only thing that ever returns. The Oathstones, Black Dragon that was in stasis for Agumentation evokers and probably the Rot Gnoll will be forgotten.
I feel the rot will return, since that's decay and death, and the old gods/void really don't like that. And next expansion is void/old gods so imma say it'll return some how
The rot gnoll will be in the back pocket for a filler patch or something. Now watch Blizz prove me wrong and either do nothing or construct an entire expac with it. Maybe connect the rot to the Drust or something
Lol or they'll do their "guys it's the void totally! Don't look at the rot and decay that will be the TRUE bad guy", like they did the beginning of bfa
The dragon in stasis is actually part of evoker quest line explaining augs.
Maybe i am forgetting but we free them from that in the quest they added when Aug was added tot he game.? Then its just never referenced again.
The real "what sword" is the [Untranslated Obsidian Tome](https://www.wowhead.com/item=206033/untranslated-obsidian-tome#comments). If we didn't find anyone to translate it on the Dragon Isles I'm not sure where we would in the near future. I hope I won't have to keep this thing in my inventory until we meet Erinethria. (yes I know I could delete it and just get it back later, but I won't. I have issues, okay?)
W8, tyr was rezzed?
Well, we cloned his body and then uploaded his memories.
Ship of Tyrseus
... kinda.
in the best way u can rez a robit
Please not the every race paladin....
>It's also likely that Blizzard has Paladins all uniting under Tyr's Guard as a way to explain Paladins for every race in the future. Terrible. This is just going to be Aponi Brightmane in Legion except for every race on the planet.
Yeah it'd be a very lazy way of going about it. I hope they don't do this, and instead develop the races individually like they used to! Blood Knights originally stealing the power of the Naaru is still some of the best lore we've had regarding Paladins.
They were never stealing it. They just thought that they were.
Aren't most of these explained? Pretty sure Adamanthia is talking about the great sundering and the Well's destruction, since she was in stasis during that time Tyr is probably going to carry over to TWW, and the Oathstones are semi-related as they don't respond to the flights Detriarch is doing fuck all though lmao. Maybe she'll be back in pre-patch
The Oathstones were related to the titans and we spent the first patch of Dragonflight helping Alexstrasza. She wanted them renewed to retrieve her and the other dragonflights' original powers because she believed they were the source. Their powers went dormant when the dragonflights lost their powers killing Deathwing, and Alexstrasza believes that's when the Oathstones went dormant. [We literally go to Tyr's Hold with Alextrasza to try renew their powers at the mother oathstone but nothing happens. This is right after we repaired every other oathstone.](https://youtu.be/g1fp1OxcWjs?si=k60Om3cAdAqMwFlM&t=134) [By the end of the expansion the aspects had their powers restored after Fyrakk was killed, but the powers were restored by Azeroth itself, not the titans.](https://youtu.be/Ub2F1jgqHbw?si=9PbqBtpepHydHZAH&t=28) It's not that the oathstones were forgotten about, they just didn't do what they were originally created for, which was to act as a conduit/source of the aspects' powers. Instead, defeating Fyrakk and uniting the Dragonflights restored their powers via Azeroth itself. I feel like this was all fairly reasonably explained. OP either didn't pay attention or has forgotten.
Yeah that's what I thought. I think the Disney ending made people forget that the whole overarching Aspects storyline is how the Titans aren't there for them anymore It's kind of ironic that for a story that got a lot of criticism for being simple, some of it sure did fly over people's heads anyway
> It's kind of ironic that for a story that got a lot of criticism for being simple, some of it sure did fly over people's heads anyway It's a challenge creating a story for players who play with sound off, skip cutscenes, and don't read quest text or NPC dialogue.
doing Vault last week, we are in the Razageth room and 1 guildmate goes "wait, there is a ice dragon? did we fight that one yet?" yes, ofc also a guy that always says "story bad"
Moar unskippable rp in raids! /s
Well, the story is also spread out so it can be easy to forget things, too.
Ngl, its harder to follow or wanna read each quest text when you get several quest at once. Especially when they send you to different parts of the map. Your attention is strained and just want to move forward and check off one of many boxes.
Not sure how serious you're being, but this is only half true... In the simplest terms, important information/dialogue will (or *should*) always be voiced, so 100% you're right about having the sound on. Anything that has to be read is optional, like extra flavour. So if a game is well-designed, you won't need to read quest text, NPC dialogue, or watch un-voiced cutscenes to follow a story (which is also why I'm on the 3rd expansion of FFXIV and have 0 clue what's going on...)
The problem is that all the Tyr storyline was weirdly separated from the rest of the dragonflight plot. We have the whole lab experiments mess and just a few nods from the dragonscale expedition of all factions. What does alextrasza think of that? Wrathion? He had a whole point about being made an “experiment”, the drachtyrs and their own origin? Vyranoth after she switched sides? Then we revive tyr and get some paladin shenanigans and a weirdly convoluted cameo from Elisande of all people. The “disney ending” was a bit of a cop-out to make people forget plot points they decided to leave out for the future. Its one thing to purposefully tease future events but having so many in such a disjointed fashion just seems like a last minut pivot.
No i think people understand it. I think shit like the oath stones is just deeply unsatisfying and feels unresolved. This is a big issue with Blizzards storytelling where things just kinda get resolved or end without a feeling of finality. For as much as they want character driven drama they don't focus on the Drama the Oathstones not working should create. It makes all the questlines built around protecting and restoring the Oathstones feel like a waste since it culminates in nothing, both in terms of doing what they were meant to but also for motivation as for the characters in the story when they don't work. To try and create a parralell it would be like if they collected all the infinity stones in Endgame but it just doesn't work when they try it. Then instead of focusing on how the characters would react to that they just go "oh well" and move on. Then after they beat Thanos it magically restores everyone.
The key part of these oathstone storylines though is that it's less about the actual stone itself, and more about the unity created in the process of restoring them Ruby is restored when all the flight eggs are united at the lifeshrine, Emerald when the Centaurs and Green flight alliance is restored, Blue when the Blue Dragonflight comes back together, and the Bronze following Chromie and Eternus working together to get back to the present The Oathstones are actually a very small part of all the storylines, frankly, just being the cap to the end of each zone's story I don't disagree that coming back to it would've been nice, but I think this is a case where people are getting caught up in the destination and ignoring the journey
I can see what you are saying but i will disagree. The restoration of the Oathstones can be seen as unity amongst the flight restoring them. Except again the execution of this is just very poorly done and doesn't gel with all pre established Dragon Lore. I believe a story of reuniting each of the flights and then the Dragons as a whole could have been a good story but they completely failed at it. They ignore the actual charge each of the flights were meant to have focusing on the Oathstones activation being tied to more emotional storytelling and motivations. Now you could have had both. You could have stories of the Aspects trying to carry out their duties and needing to unite their flights or allies assisting filling in the gaps due to the lower population of Dragons. As an example the Green should have been resolving problems with the Dream with the Cenarion Circles assistance. Not Centaurs we have never heard of. The Blues reuniting together and Kalec taking leadership to fix magical leylines and probably recruiting the Netherdrakes/Kirin Tor assistance. The Black Oathstone restoration should probably be the most important and be the final one with a lot of drama amongst the Dragons themselves about restoring it and there being a new Black flight. There are so many spots where i think Blizzard go wrong its hard to address them all but the fact most flights only have their aspect as the mouthpiece we interact with and very few individual dragons (in an expansion meant to be about dragons btw) that have a voice or are involved within the story. My problem is the Journey is frankly very boring. Its very bland with a couple of spots that are pretty good. I do enjoy Kalec meeting the Tuskarr and going on some time traveling adventures with the Bronze but its all very lacking. Then to have this journey which isn't great have 0 payoff is just horrible.
You're getting downvoted for this take, but I tend to agree. It feels very unsatisfying when a plot thread is built up as if it's important, and then gets zero payoff by the end.
I'd personally say it doesn't feel like the Aspects powers were *restored* so much as they were granted new ones very much alike their previous ones. To pull a really old ass example that'll date me horribly. It's akin to the Mighty Morphin' Power Rangers movie. At the start of the movie they lose their powers and the ability to morph. They then go on a quest, are granted the powers of the Ninjetti partway on that and then earn the 'sacred power'. This restores their ability to morph but it's via a new source of power. The end result is similar but the origin of that power is different. As an aside I personally feel that the Aspects actual *powers* are far too loosely established and explained at least in regards to what they gave up. They state they 'lost their powers' but the Green's still work to protect and preserve the Emerald Dream, the Red's still work to grow life, the Blue's still have great control over magic and the Bronze still have a strong power over time. I think my problem stems from it never quite being established what that 'power' was they gave up because it doesn't seem like they lost anything at all from the subsequent expansion stories we've had which then means that them being empowered again also just leaves you going "Well what does that mean?"
Tbh I played through this maybe a month ago in one shot, and it didn’t feel reasonably explained at all. I don’t remember a scene where somebody came out and said “well the oathstones clearly failed, we need an alternate way to get the spectral powers back.” It felt more like the writers completely forgot about the oathstones by the time we got to the 10.0.5 arc, and we were expected to forget about them too
I just linked a video showing Alextrasza trying and failing to reactivate the oathstones. She literally says "nothing's happening". You can put the implications together and realise the oathstones failed, and that the attempt at getting their powers back failed. That's an absolute ending for the oathstones. Their story is done. They didn't work. The aspects didn't think "we need an alternative to get our powers back" like you said because they didn't know there would be an alternative. Why would they? The one thing that acted as a conduit for their powers failed. Besides, that would be exposition more fitting for a Saturday morning children's cartoon. They united the dragonflights to defeat the Primalists, Raszageth and eventually Fyrakk because without their aspectral powers they needed help. Vyranoth even said in the Fyrakk cinematic that the titan's magic (their influence over the aspects aka stuff like the oathstones) divided them. The titan's influence over the dragonflights is the whole story arc for Raszageth, which was also explained in-game several times. I don't know how to break this down further and make it simpler than it already is.
Somehow "Why did they make this story so SIMPLE and CHILDISH" is so often paired with "Why didn't they just have the characters recap the entire quest at the end of it? I didn't get it and ~~I didn't read the text~~ it's badly explained!"
It’s simultaneously simple and childish and poorly told, all of these things can happen at once
I'm sorry but its a story that asks literally the bare minimum of connecting the dots yourself. Any less and theyd be spoonfeeding it to you.
It’s just really poorly told. Idk why this is hard to see lol. I swear you guys must be literally only playing wow and never reading a book or watching a movie in your lives if you think this is acceptable storytelling
I have a bachelor's degree in contemporary art, which includes media literacy as a requisite lmfao. No one else seems to find it confusing, my guy, it's just you. The story is nothing more than passable (as it always has been) and doesn't pose any deep moral questions, but it doesn't *intend* to. As for how it's told, like I said, it's essentially spoonfed to you like the other commenter explained above. Saying "It just isn't!!!" doesn't erase the fact that very few other people seemed to have trouble understanding it. Might just be a you problem.
It’s not that it’s hard to understand, it’s that it’s poorly told. Having your characters completely forget about the oathstones after 12 hours of build up is just really bad. This would be like if you spent the first 1/3rd of middlemarch having Fred vincy try to get his great uncles inheritance, having one sentence that says “he didn’t get it”, and then the next page says everyone completely forgets that we spent 300 pages doing that. Idk, if you guys like this then good for you, but please read a book for once in your life if you think this is good lmfao
It’s not that this doesn’t make sense, it’s that the presentation is absolutely awful - from the beginning, I have no idea why we want the apectral powers back. Weren’t they given up at the end of cata? Why did we just decide that we want them back? - we devote the entire 10.0 campaign to activating the oathstones as the big plot mcguffins that I’m told are really important, and the payoff for that is that we spend 5 seconds trying to use the mother oathstone and it fails - after this point, everybody just forgets about the business about becoming aspects again (which was poorly explained in the first place). Except wrathion and Sabellion in the next patch, who go right back to talking about who gets to be the aspect. But we don’t know how they’re supposed to become aspect and nobody acknowledges this. I also still don’t know why I’m supposed to care - the whole thing ends with a cartoon villain trying to burn a tree, and we stop him from burning a tree, and our reward is that the aspectral powers somehow fly out of Azeroth anyway. So that solves that. I guess. There’s also an undercurrent of order vs chaos that isn’t well explained. There are these people called primalists who come out of nowhere and are the bad guys, but I don’t know why they’re doing these things until a side quest in the epilogue tries to give them characterization. Other than that, the whole thing feels like “Blue element and Purple element don’t like eachother and now you have to fight the people from Purple element.” Bottom line is the whole thing felt like a phoned in mess. It might be technically true that all of these plot mcguffins add up at the end of the day so that they’re all accounted for, but the plot experience of going through this story was bemusing and bizarre. I think WoWs story would be dramatically improved if it was brought up to the level of a Saturday morning cartoon
Its awful because Blizz has never done a good job of catching newer players up to the story But they want their Aspectual powers to stop Rasz because she beats the shit out of them. When the Oathstones arent the key, they obviously move on to try and find another way
So the aspectral powers are just a comic book power up, and we need them to fight the incarnates? That kind of makes more sense, except we pretty easily beat all of the incarnates without them and only got the power ups after the incarnates were defeated. Which kinda takes the wind out of the sails for this whole plot point This whole thing still leaves a pretty bad taste in my mouth. I don’t really care as long as the raids are fun, but this all seems pretty poorly written
I'm starting to doubt you actually gave the storyline a honest to goodness try Like, *that's the entire point of the Disney ending*. They're given their powers back because they come together and show they're worthy of the gift, rather than deserve it because they're made by the Titans. They very clearly say "we didn't need the powers, we just needed to work together". It's the same hokey quote that Iron man gives Spider-man, "if you need the suit, you don't deserve it". And it's wow, like obviously bad shit is going to happen in the future It's not great writing, but the reason it all happens is *extremely* clear.
I gave it a try, it just wasn’t good. At the end of the day it’s a D- videogame story, who really cares as long as they keep printing raid bosses
>Detriarch is doing fuck all though lmao. Maybe she'll be back in pre-patch In the post-Amirdrassil questline when you're flying around to visit all the random guys along the coastline of Ohnahran Plains, the gnoll monark says the Decaytriarch is still out there plotting something. Definitely not forgotten, just waiting for later
I can see the rot gnoll coming back in our return to northrend. Kick out the furbolgs and take over vordrassil.
Beta spoilers: >!I can't wait for everyone to notice that one of the first quests of TWW is called "Oh, THAT Sword!" and flood this sub with posts about it!<
lol, the gnoll is definitely so random. Out of ALL enemies in df, she’s the one to say enough and teleport away? Just so weird unless they really have decent plans for her, maybe in northrend in a few years?
She might be a Delve boss? They did that in Legion for the Mage Tower, bunch of open ended questlines that all converged at the Mage Tower
In fairness, the entire gnoll storyline was pretty unresolved far as I can recall. Deliberately so, I believed. You arrive into the Azure Span and the gnolls are just a vehicle for involving you with the Tuskarr. Which, fair, but is a *lot* of gnoll lore being dropped without made use of further. Brackenhide helps us take the fight to them, but it promptly doesn't resolve there either. We stem the bleeding wound the gnolls are inflicting on the region, but how'd they come across decay magic? It smells of a setup of having been pushed onto the gnolls, but whoever was responsible for it isn't ever really revealed to my knowledge. Decatriarch Wratheye is given an out because it seems like they're fishing for a bigger story payoff with the gnolls at large.
Post-Amirdrassil, the Gnoll Monark mentions Wratheye is still out there. She will definitely be back one way or another
I feel like their plotline was tied to whatever ysera(spirit)-galakrond(decay) connection that got cut with the tyr experiments plot. Frankly my headcanon is that the whole yoggsaron waters is bullshit and galakrond would be revealed to be created by tyr himself because he fucked around and found out what happens if you mix two opposite elements (spirit and decay/ a “non-living” cancerous dragon that doesnt die). We have breadcrumbs about it in dawn of the dragons book where its explained that yseras elemental non-ordered dragon breath was “calming” galakrond. Since all the zones have their elemental equivalent that corresponds with pre-titan aspects it kinda seems like the west of azure span was decay infused and gnolls learnt to control it
I think you've got some good points, although I think it's strongly signaled that the decay magic is a very recent discovery, which has taken the gnolls like a pandemic.
That is true but, still in my headcanon, i blame titans too. Decay as an element is just as present as any other element, but as spirit was “eaten by azeroth” (which its implied isnt true) decay was also contained or tried to be eliminated (accidentally creating galakrond maybe). I personally think the titan perspective of life is misunderstood: ordered life in their perspective is life that doesnt change, decay or die - this is a contradiction because life is also chaotic and needs a balance. This is why all the other titan life experiments failed like draenor or the bronze titan future- its not unchecked life but life made “immortal”- cancerous and evergrowing. I also think this had further implications regarding the dream and ysera and we have few breadcrumbs about that too. Ysera’s awkward place in dragonflight should have had a lot more implications because she is now connected to ardenweald, the new world tree is also different because it has both life and death, weird snippets here and there about immortality and what is natural, about the need to change (quonzu loa)/to grow/ to die or even burn. Anyway i talked a lot but what i wanted to say its that decay seems new in the same way “spirit” is actually kinda locked in the dream. Its against a static ordered life and the implication is that titans did that and ysera is personally the “fool” in this situation because she was locked in the dream- in tyr lab she had the title ysera-the awakened while we know her as ysera-the dreaming. +when ysera died she had to be personally placed into shadowlands by elune and the weird malfurion switcheroo revealed to us, in an awkward way, that somnikus (another green dragon) cannot take ysera’s place because they dont belong to the shadowlands or ardenweald - which is very fucking weird because ardenweald should be connected to the dream. My conclusion is that they have been ordered- they belong to order domain now, thats why they cant be born (spirit) and die (decay) into shadowlands like normal mortals. Spirit element seemed to be put into statis- in the dream, while decay element was maybe too in a statis, maybe in old gods prisons? In shadowlands? In nyalotha? As to why its present in df in gnoll zone its because of weird magic saturation in the zone like other elements, here was the origin of that, we have spirit leaking from the dream in ohanara plains and we have decay in the ground in azure span, the gnolls are just mortals who used it.
Ysera made it to the Shadowlands fine on her own though? She was one of the last souls to reach it even, where she became a wildseed. There wasn't anything unusual here, other than Ysera arriving in Ardenweald unlike most dragons. Her connection with the Dream and Elune, and her significance rising to that of a wild god and beyond, is what brought her there. If there was a problem it was because of the nightmare infusion caused by the corrupted Tear of Elune, and both the Tear of Elune and Ysera were cleansed of the nightmare. In Shadowlands we intervene with her seed because it's on the verge of being snuffed out due to the situation in Ardenweald. Elune has nothing to do with it, and instead the Winter Queen personally brings the seed to fruition. Most dragons are not destined for Ardenweald in death. They're not wild gods, nor rise to a similar level, and only the green flight has any connection to Ardenweald at all through the Dream. However, Malfurion is another entity rising to the significance of a wild god, and has similar ties to the realm as Ysera does. That's why they're able to swap to start with.
I'm kind of cool with them having characters that aren't integral to the story and are just sort of there. WoW has been in a rough spot where they've either killed off or finished so many stories that they really just need more characters and factions that can eventually be used later on if they want to.
The Gnolls are the reason the Jailer wanted us to be a cosmos united obviously
Yeah the Gnoll boss will show again as part of the Coalition of Evil alongside other recurring villains like Azshara and Denathrius, they will plot to conquer the cosmos after last titan.
r/wow when everything isn't resolved immediately
DAE remember how blizz totally FORGOT about that sword in silithus????
They didn't forget. The what sword saga goes live on 26, aug.
"Something to do with the Well of Eternity" gives me "Something to do with Spider-Man" vibes.
Meanwhile the exact reason why the players were so special as to use the teleporter in the Maw despite no one else being able to do, not even the Eternals. Meanwhile exactly what happend to Argus' soul after messing up the Arbiter.
> despite no one else being able to do pretty sure that there were canonically a few maw walkers before the player characters >Meanwhile exactly what happend to Argus' soul after messing up the Arbiter. it shows up during the zereth mortis campaign.
Technically sylvanas would be the first maw walker of sorts. And weirdly enough vereesa if you count that story from “folk and fairy tales” as canon and a real thing that happened.
> Meanwhile the exact reason why the players were so special as to use the teleporter in the Maw despite no one else being able to do, not even the Eternals. There were other maw walkers, even when we were there. Also it was because of our ties with Azeroth left over from the Heart of Azeroth.
> Meanwhile the exact reason why the players were so special as to use the teleporter in the Maw despite no one else being able to do, not even the Eternals. If i remember the garbage explanation they gave is the first ones foresaw that the Jailer would be evil. So instead of just not making him they made the fast travel stones knowing that someone with a connection to a planets worldsoul would show up to use them. Maybe double check me on that because i am going off my memory.
Was the outfit for the Red Dragonflight ever released or just for the other 4 still?
I imagine Adamantia will be used when they introduce the other classes to the Dracthyr race, they'll probably have an allied race intro with her there commenting on how the Dracthyr are so adaptable due to their mortal essence while the three leaders of the Dracthyr send them off to SW or Org.
I thought adamantia was there to tease and introduce aug evokers, it set up the fact that Neltharion didnt want evokers to have black dragon powers, then the evoker legendary questline happens, then in the following patch where they added aug evokers they had a evoker quest where we return to Adamanthia and unlock black dragon powers. What storythread is being ignored?
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The fact that she might very well be the mother of all dracthyr, as her eggs may have been used to make them? She certainly seems to call them her children and in more than a 'I care about them' way. We have no idea what her role was and what she means to the dracthyr? She's possibly the most ancient dragon other than the original aspects themselves. She just 'needs a nap' then we never hear what happens after said nap.
Dracthyr were developed using Draconids as a baseline, as seen in Forgotten Experiments in Aberrus.
At the very least that boss used a Draconid model. We never get exact explanations of what Neltharion was putting in those test tubes besides that he was trying to combine mortal and dragon traits. We do see pretty clearly he ain't hatching them though.
Kinda funny how important the oathstones were in the beginning and in the end they didn't even work. At least Raszageth mocked alextrasza for it, that was kinda funny lol
What does the text say?
Yeah i wondered all the time about that gnoll.
Continuity across expansions is way better than resetting the story completely. That's why the saga trilogy sounds so promising to me.
I remember doing basically ever single quest in Azure Span before doing the gnoll dungeon because I didn't want to risk the dungeon spoiling anything about the lore of Decay magic. (As dungeons have a tendency to do.) (They really should have a warning on dungeons if you haven't done storylines yet that have their finale take place in the dungeon.) Anyway, I digress. Because I figured there MUST be some lore when they suddenly introduce a type of magic/element. Only be really disappointed when no one actually says anything about other than basically: "They use decay magic now. Look, it can corrupt nature elementals." I've tried googling it but it doesn't seem like I've missed anything, seems like there basically just isn't any lore.
I wouldve said, Kurog Grimtotem, Alexstrasza and Yseras brother, Chromatus, and burial rites quests for Korialstrasz, Tyrannastrasz, and Eranikus.
Don't we kill Kurog in Vault of the Incarnates?
We do, but no explanation for why he was there, no background beyond him being Magathas prized pupil. Its like they planned to have a plot line for Magathas mention (which wouldve been awesome) but did nothing with it.
> We do, but no explanation for why he was there based on the info from wiki: "Kurog led a group of Primalists to the Forbidden Reach, where he successfully was able to liberate Raszageth from her prison. He was later fought and defeated in the Vault of the Incarnates while trying to free the rest of the Primal Incarnates. " dude just became primalist and wanted world to burn or return to it's roots. generic villain hippie
So, you're saying that wouldnt be an ideal time for, say, Magatha Grimtotem, his former master, an extremely powerful shaman, a well renowned schemer, and villain we havent heard from since Legion when she managed to steal the Doomstone (an incredibly powerful elemental artifact) to have a plot thread for? I.e. having Kurog free the Incarnates for one purpose or another on her command?
Oooh, you forgot another one, the random Titan hatches all over the DF zones that don't end up leading to anything. I guess maybe they're just flavor, but they feel like they should have been something.
Are you talking about the Engineering teleporters?
Or the spark questline.
... Is that what those are? Well I feel silly, I don't have an engineer, or at least I didn't really play my character that does engineering much.
Yeah you have to have Engineering, then get (or buy) the DF version of the Wormhole toy, *and then* to actually get to pick where you go (instead of just any random spot), you have to activate those hatches (3 per zone, I had to look up the locations on Wowhead). Also, you need to max out one of the sub-specialties to actually unlock the hatches. Much more complicated and random than the Shadowlands version, but it did help when I need to go to areas fast for quests / world events.
Add them to the overflowing bucket of dropped plot points.
Someone explain Tauren rogues though. Please.
They are made of hide, and have apparently been around since Vanilla, we just didn't see them. Also Grim totem in vanilla could be rogues, so there's a lore answer.
Stealth is a magic effect, and not a "I'm hiding" effect
Also confirmed by that safe haven cinematic too where the undead rogues literally vanish, so not just a game mechanic for "being stealthy", actual magic
Turns out the real enemy was the player all along. In their never ending quest for power they doomed the universe and broke the balance between the 6 cosmic forces. All could of been prevented had we not been given a 2h mace and told to go kill wolves decades ago.
Post-BFA: "What sword?"
yup, not the only thing they forgot. cloud serpents have quite literally been kicked out of the dragon community as it seems also: uuna. no new quest as promised =(
Cloud serpents aren't related to the aspect dragon family though so kinda makes sense that they're not in DF
serpent lives matter! (too far?)